Troy,
As per your other post, and for the naive like myself amongst us, please can you explain quite what is so 'Good', as you put it, about USA and quite what is so 'Old', as you put it, about USA, I was of the impression that, in comparison to others, USA is a relatively new country.
I await education, life is a learning process after all!
The 13 original colonies were founded in the 1600s--but the southwestern US has cities much older than Jamestown or Plymouth. Remember too that Spanish merchant vessels have visited since before Drake first seen San Francisco Bay,and communities like Tucson date back to the 1400s. Of course--these were Mexican at that time. Before the Bering strait ceased to be a land bridge which connected us to Russia,massive pilgimages travelled to this country. There is nothing new about the colonization of any country. Kennewick man ( Washington state) is dated to sometime around Noah`s flood ( The last ice age) What is good,and I do repeat myself time and time again--is that of all the countries in the world--Give me your tired,give me your poor huddled masses yearning to be free. To my knowledge there is no other country which compares in the exodus of international immigration. WHat is not great about a country which unites,and in a short 150 years,becomes the world superpower,dominating ( good and bad) and influencing everything internationally? Even as a boy-I took great pride in the fact that our Montana hard red wheat was traded to hungry Russians. Think what you may--but we are giving to Pakistan emergency support even after our southern Gulf states have suffered so much,and we have squandered millions of dollars and thousands of American lives in Iraq.We give and give again--and it is every person here who gives of their tax dollars ( also good and bad) to support the downtrodden and defenseless people of the world. It is only 60 years since we came to the aid of the man who said," We will fight the enemy in our homes,and in the streets". We did not ignore England because of her tyranny, ( supposed-if you are a closet Tory) her indenturing of American seamen,the war of 1812. We stood alongside our British forebears. You should be proud of the fact that I--like most Americans,would come to the aid of the UK without question,and with the immediacy reserved for family. I do not stand behind many political policies,but I stand proud to protect and defend England and to consider your country as my long lost brother of another mother. Even though many Americans have little culture,there are people like me who resist nationalism and embrace internationalism,because we stand together as a great conglomeration of the many colors and ethnicities of the world. I won`t even get into the beauty of America geographically. I grew up with grizzly bears,eagles,and majestic royal bull elk. When Woody Guthrie wrote the song This land is Your land,this land is my land,he very well knew that the basic principles of freedom involved all peoples great and small. It is not easy to be the referee to the world,and I think that because we enjoy individual freedoms,we owe it to the world to be the caring big brother,irregardless of our republic`s age. Just my humble opinion!
Spirit
As a functioning unified nation it is a baby compared to Britain. You see the sense in the opposition to this nationalistic fervor that the USA suffers from and I do mean suffer. Good there is hope.
There was another country in Europe that had such an attitude. They were number one and the best. They were so superior that they thought they had the right to rule the world.
Hope that doesn't happen here. Especially with a president who likes to makes such important decision with the help of his imaginary friend.
The only nazis I see are the ones that are trying so desperately to impose their monotheistic, guns all round, me first attitude on the rest of us. Thank goodness that the USA has a few of us that are not extreme. Mind you that gets interpreted as being 'liberal' whatever that means.
Such a country, that has so called men of God on their own television channels that advocate the asassination of the president (Venezuela) of another country because they don't agree with their political views.
Then to have the gall to take the moral high ground on so many world and personal issues. Such hypocrisy!
The world looks on and sees the emperor has no clothes and mocks. Unfortuately it merely causes a siege mentality rather than actually causing a look to be taken at the real situation and applying a little impartial critical thought.
Any country that spawns an army of its people that have to continually wave a flag and tell everybdy else how great they are has a lot of growing up to do. Martin in his very simple sentences (unlike mine) has hit the nail on the head.
Wish I had not had to say what I have said but I can't stuff it anymore.
Your talk of aid - to me - is very much like the old Salvation Army policy of no soup without attending service first. Give with an open heart and equally or don't give at all. What did Israel do to get as much foreign aid as all the other countries in the world combined from the USA? I would surely like to hear an answer to that conundrum.
Two word answer power and corruption. At a staggeringly high level.
When I criticise the USA governmental / legal system as being corrupt at core and so unwieldy as to be unusable I am told so name a better one. It is simple answer - Britain's.
Bottom line answer - well love it or leave it. Go back where you came from.
The redneck equivalent of saying shut up, shut up repeatedly. Just like a small child. America is not particularly old or good. The big strong teenager neeeds to listen to the wisoned old, physically weak grandfather once and a while.
'nuff said. I don't usually touch these subjects because they are so sensitive but Martin and the idiot who posted earlier touched a nerve.
I am sorry I really do not mean to insult anybody personally but the intrusive nature of religion, abortion, we are the best and anyone who disagreees with us is an asshole just makes my flesh crawl.
Again sorry.
Wait a minute!I believe the question was " what is so good?",and, "what is so old",not "what is bad". As with any country of the world--we do not suffer the good people of Russia for Stalinism,or the sins of Brezhnev,no more than we compare the people of Germany with Dr.Mengele. As always,I put people before politicizing rhetoric. The question itself has less to do with administrative ballyhoo,and more to do with this country as a whole. I do not say we are the best. But I feel that my words have been negated by attitudes irrelevant to the question. The question`s answer--if it has anything to do with politics--is reflective of generations of administrations--not just the Bush monarchy. There are flag wavers from every country-so this has nothing to do with it either. Rural farmers detested Hitler,and were killed massively for their protests. Stalin tried to starve Ukraine out of existence! I think an attitude prevailed in the response to my post. Bureaucratic control and world domination have nothing to do with the common people of this country.Government IS corrupt,and few countries can say differently. US aid to Israel was meant to be grant money,which was later "forgiven" by congress. The Israelis brag that they have always made good on their US debt--but what debt? WHy we still send over 5 billion dollars a year to a country which is destroying the "aid" thanks to the Palestinians --I do not know. Hey--I want aid too--just like foreigners who are granted interest free loans!! I know that Tom Jefferson said that rebellion is healthy,and that the citizenry has a right to abolish government. Basically he justified anarchy--when the monster of politics became too largely unconstrained and broke free of the cage, ( the will of the general population) the people had the right to impeach and reestablish government. Again,the question is,"what is so good",and "what is so old" about the USA. I concede the point of age--yes Izi,this is still a youngster,and one that kills it`s princes also-like our dear cousins did in royal fashion,and a ruling consortium squanders the hard earned money of the laboring class. But I would like to know what anybody else thinks is good about America. Maybe I will yet be persuaded to find a nice little dacha near the Black Sea!!
I wasn't being political, or indeed racist, when I said what I said nor was I saying that one nation is better than another.
'Shit for Brains' did that, he came along waving his Stars & Stripes, he probably has boxer shorts of the same design, and I merely asked him to expand upon his description of USA.
every country has its dark sides in the history. if you mention stalin, breshnev and mengele, you also have to add the killing of 90% of the native indian population of the today usa. also keep in mind, when in the usa the flag of democraty was waving slavery was a well established thing in the usa. the anti democratic kingdoms in europe at the same time didnīt accept any slavery.
the war in irak has nothing to do with fighting for freedom and democrcy. it is nothing else than an economic war.
the reason to invade into sudan would be much more understandable. hundred-thousands of southsudanese people were and are still killed. osama bin l. even had an own company there.
Spirit
Hair splitting.
Always people say to me (and I have had 21 years of this) Ok so name a government that isn't corrupt or has an uncorrupt electoral system.
Errr that would be Britain followed by Britain! Also Germany, France, Sweden, Norway, Holland................
Always the amazing thing to me is that anybody with an ounce of intelligence attempts to defend these points. I could tear apart each one of your points as Worldtraveler has done with just one but I will not because this is not the purpose of this forum.
I will just say one little thing and then leave it. Britain has never starved its own people or killed 90% of a particular group of them. It also is a melting pot and has been for thousands of years not 400. That is 3 zeros.
Jobs have people appointed to them not elected. He who has the biggest pile of money does not win the election. There is medical care for everybody and old people actually have enough money to eat. I am not going to continue with this because it is pointless and there is a pat answer for every thing I have said so it is a circular argument. Just like telling a christian he is living in a fantasy. Same thing.
What I was getting at was not the killing,because societies topple or consume ( or try to ) societies. WHat I was simply asking was what is good about the US. Some things have changed,and very dramatically,but here are a few of my own favorites-from my own backyard; clamming,oystering,and gathering mussels on the beaches of Whidbey Island and Hood Canal,Washington. Mount Rainier,the Sierra Nevadas,The whole Rocky Mountain chain--with Glacier,Yellowstone and many other attractions therein. The coastline from San Diego all the way to Port Townsend,Washington. Watching killer whales--or better yet,tandem leaping dolphins accompanying your quiet sailboat. The many miles of beach that can still be driven on or camped upon. The taste of a flash pan fried elk steak, wild huckleberries,or several different mushrooms.Alpine skiing in high country with a friend. Putting around in the same mountains in the summer on some of the same trails previously skiied upon. Fishing in a pristine stream and having fresh trout on the breakfast fire--it always makes the eggs taste better! Being on a remote mountaintop and the sound of nothing. High enough that you can see trails of the Great Milky Way,and millions of stars, yet cannot see the person directly in front of you.A crackling camp fire sending curliques dancing like pixies while you see the images of your life playing out on the flames. Small and charming towns--again, like Port Townsend,Port Ludlow,Hoquiam,Two-Dot Montana,Minot or Grenora North Dakota,Spearfish,South Dakota--and on and on,where people are not so paranoid or self-focused that they will be 20 feet past you on the street when you are putting together your response to " how`s it going? Small organized shindigs,like the mud races-where any vehicle is admissable for the 1000 dollar purse privately collected from the proceeds of the party organizer. Taking a 3-5 day float on many rivers on your own raft,inner tube,or vessel of choice. Waking up in a mountain meadow with your beloved,or snuggling with her after the long hard day of rafting! A child catching his first fish from the river,and also catching the fishing "bug". Creamery picnics,logger`s day celebrations and exhibitions,western days and rodeos. The small county fairs. There is so much more I could go on forever. I tend to see the most good in nature-not people particularly ( may my favorite mountain not be drilled for oil by Bush and company! ) I am certain that in Europe there are many charms,and the invasion of Romans,Teutons,Saxons,and Gauls and countless other contributors to cultural heritage does not take away from those wonderful attributes. I do not like homophobic and inarticulate people,and I abhore it in women who are supposed to be the fair sex. I just had an answering "letter" (if you can call it that) from a woman whom I wrote my life history to. Her reply to me basically was " What?" I loosely base my life in defiance of the seven deadly sins-all of which are irritating to me. And qualities I cannot stand in a person,let alone a woman.I really did not want to find opposite ends with anybody here. Just a little celebration of the spirit,and how even in a crumbling pile of rock one might get lucky and find gold.