I've been speaking to the girl for a while now and we were talking every day and then I didn't here from her for a few days. I found out by an IP trace that she is now in Egypt and she won't say what sort of work she is doing.
She has not asked for any money, I've been talking to her for 3 weeks since she has been in Egypt (email, text) but I wonder why she won't tell me. I've sort of figured out she is working at a resort but thats about it.
Should I insist that she tell me?
She has a laptop which I thought was really weird, that is how I know she is in Egypt. I scam checked her before she left and everything checked out and when she was in Ukraine I spoke with her on the phone.
She is also on a good broadband connection because she can download a 10mb file as fast as I can send it to her. So I'm thinking she is working at a hotel or something like that. She says she will be home in December.
This girl seems really nice any advice, thoughts would be great. Again she has not ask for a nickel.
There are many Russian and Ukrainian girls working at the many Red Sea resorts. Most of them are dancers, few work as entertainment and program leaders at hotels and some are $200 a night prostitutes. There are also a few business ladies which I very much doubt your girl is one of.
she has good broadband? so skype a video call with her if she has her own laptop. webcams are very cheap anywhere. easy to hide truths over email/sms, not so easy over voice+video. me and olya share video and chat almost whenever we are awake, as a way of keeping in touch while i am back in UK. /pete
I wondered about the hooker thing to be honest, she gets in almost every night at around midnight cairo time. She says she doees not like it there, the last email from her said she was going to come home early, so hard to say. I've sent her a letter about skype but she has not set it up yet so we will see. Her english is very good but her computer skills are so-so at best.
She also told me she has had way too many banana milkshakes which make me think she works at a bar or whatever, so maybe she is making money hooking, or maybe she is just working as a waitress and has not done anything else, I really do not know. She works from noon until midnight with a break around 8pm or so.
It blew her mind when I knew she was in Cairo, that was funny, she had no idea about being able to trace where she is from an IP address.
She says she is there with some of her friends who are also working, it makes me wonder why she won't tell me, Should I just wait or should I tell her I need to know?
Another interesting thing is that I will write her a long email and she replies with sometimes just a paragraph, whenever I have pushed on this asking if she is really interested in me she responds almost imediately saying she is. The last time I told her I was sorry for bothering her so much when she was busy and she replied that she enjoys hearing from me and it makes her day to get messages from me - well it would be nice to get some back!! Is it common for Ukraine/Russian girls to be of few words? Its a bit frustrating as how else can you get to know each other? She also says she is tired from working long hours which of course could be true and who wants to write an email when you are exhausted?
She wants me to come visit her when she is back from Egypt, she never asks about money, her questions are about my kids, what I'm doing, stuff like that. She did tell me she is depressed being there and does not like to talk as much when she is depressed. She has a daughter which she obviously misses. She did write much longer emails when she was at home.
It seems like an inauspicious beginning to a relationship.
You already don't trust her, and have had to resort to cyber-sleuthing to find out basic information, such as where she is living at the moment. She is not being forthcoming about her work situation and is not participating equally in your correspondence.
So, if you want an honest suggestion... move on, find another girl.
What's the point of having a relationship like this? If you met a girl at home, and after three weeks she wouldn't tell you where she lived or what kind of work she was doing, what would you do?
Its not that I don't trust her, I simply asked what she is doing in Egypt after I found out and she would not tell me. She could tell me she was hooking, I'd still talk to her but probably not go see her. She would not expect I'd have that reaction obviously. She had wanted to see a video of me so I put it on a server and as an afterthought I looked at the logs to see what her IP address is and then I found out where she was.
Yes I think you are correct, its BS that she went off to Egypt and not telling me. So I think I'll chat to see what she has to say but I guess I already knew it was not going anywhere.
Too bad, she seemed really nice, maybe she has some issues I have no idea about but yes, probably time to move on. I'll post what happens over the next couple days, but yes, I think you are right VN
The one thing that did cross my mind is that she went there thinking she was going to be serving drinks or whatever and now she is being forced to prositute herself. The letters before she left were completely different than the ones I get from her now. You wonder things like is she being drugged and that is why her letters are so short, its enough to make you go slightly insane if you imagine all the possibilities.
Joel....these girls that go to egypt, turkey, dubai are not being forced to do anything......it is that thing called 'money' which spurrs many of us to almost anything. I wouldn't be surprised if this was not her first time there.
How many times do I read that guys say 'she hasn't asked for any money'.....that doesn't mean anything. Money is made now through web sites, chat rooms, letters and of course, expenses while visiting girl.
By the way, is she your girlfriend where she has to tell you where she is going? Seems you were the one leading that correspondence.
"these girls that go to egypt, turkey, dubai are not being forced to do anything"
Thats wrong. It still happens. Much of the FSU is still in dire straights, making much less income that we might imagine. I know of many situations where girls have been offered waitress jobs, or elderly-care jobs, supposedly only requirig her to be responsible for taking care of a single elderly person. Even such meager jobs pay big money compared to say, handling out advertising fliers in Moldova (a job my exgirlfriend and her mother did recently making around 6 to 10 dollars a WEEK).
Forced prositution is STILL a big problem once the girl gets over there and the promised job is not as promised, or not avilable at all. Passports are often confiscated and the girls have little left to do except coperate as they are generally in the country illegally and afraid to go to the proper authorities.
The New Yorker ran an interesting story on it just a month ago - its still a MAJOR probem.
Joel:
Whether or not that is what occured here I do not know. I DO know that my exfiance from Moldova (who is 28) was recruited for just such a job this last summer. But at the last moment, I talked her OUT of going to Turkey, supposedly for an innocent waitressing job.
If this girl is proud she is not going to ask you for money under ANY circumstances (man would rather starve than do that) - but she may have taken a job she considered innocent without telling you. She certainly WON'T tell you if she is involved in prositution though as she knows it will change everything between you.
Does anybody here think that Turkey is really so desperate for waitresses - that they have to be imported from Moldova and Ukraine? Of course not. But to the girls themselves - the prospect of EMPLOYMENT - let alone employment perhaps paying a THOUSAND EUROS A MONTH is just too good of an opportunity to pass up! They figure that they can LIVE on a little of that and send money HOME. Relatives working illegally outside of the country is STILL the number one source of income to Moldova. And these offers CAN be legitimate. My ex-girlfriends male cousing works in Italy caring for an elderly man. He doesn't like it - has no outside life - is afraid of going outside or speaking lest anyone figures he is an illegal. The family that employs him likes the arrangement - grampa has a responsible dedicated attendant 24/7 and they pay a low wage and don't have to pay any taxes on his services. Of course he is warned that he BETTER NOT GET SICK - as he cannot use the hospital or a local doctor! And he dutifully sends home around 500 Euros evey month to his family in Moldova.
Since this arrangement CAN be legitimate, relatively speaking (like above) a lot of women overlook the danger and go themselves with the dream of waitress or elderly care jobs - OFTEN they are recruited by friends and family (believe it or not) who are desperate, or who in a strage twist were vitcimized themselves similarly. Seems some women get their freedom and a bit more cash by getting NEW recruits in essense victimizing in the same way that they were victimized.
But as mentioned above - when women are recruited there is a better than even chance that they will be led prositution - whether they wanted to or not.
Just to clarify, Ukrainian nationals can get visas to Egypt and Turkey at the airport for less than $25.00. They are good for 3 months and can easily be renewed. The being forced to work and not being able to go to the police premise does not apply here. Very few foreign waitresses work in Egypt, it sounds like your girl is a dancer, maybe a belly dancer!
The girls are not stupid to believe they are going to Western Europe to waitress for a thousand Euros. They know however, they can be sold in some countries for that amount.
The more I think about this the more I think jetba.. is probably onto something, she has gotten less and less comunicative since she has been there, she used to write 3-4 page emails to me, now I'm lucky to get a paragraph. I was talking to this girl, her english is good, she would laugh on the phone, we talked about getting together, and now she still wants to meet at Christmas when she is back in Ukraine, but she is not happy at all. She told me she will send me some new pictures of her so maybe that will tell me something.
In a way it would be easier if it wasn't so good before as I would just move on.
I'm not going to give up on this yet, I will see where it goes.
Joel I know the parents of a Russian girl in my country. Their daughter is working as a pole dancer. No one is forcing the girl to do that sort of work, quite the opposite, naturally the parents are not happy about it. The girl chooses to do that sort of work for the easy money.
My guess is 99.9% of the girls that do that sort of work choose to do it for the money.
To try and change or help one of these girl is like trying to help a drug addict or telling someone to stop smoking.
They do what they want to do.
"The girls are not stupid to believe they are going to Western Europe to waitress for a thousand Euros."
Well obviously the wage will be lower in Turkey or Egypt. But higher in Italy. Could not find any real figures to give an indication of what a waitress makes in WESTERN EUROPE - but I found something specific to UK.
Adman - I am certain she is there for the money, she has told me so, what she did not tell me is what she is doing, she certainly has the looks to be a dancer, so could be she is, does that mean she is a prositute, possibly? I know what she did in Ukraine, she was a teacher which is a very low paying job and worked as a speach therapist, another low paying job she has a daughter to support and her monther does not work so I can't say I blame her for doing whatever it is she is doing.
She is definately not happy being there, I did find out that this is the first time she has been there. She is there with two of her friends, so maybe they are all dancing, She has sent me pictures with her and her friends who are there they are all attractive. I could talk to her friends as they are all on Мой Мир but I have not done so.
I think I will go see her in December anyway. I think its worth seeing her face to face and I'll know from that, I really could not give a damn about 2-3k of expenses going over there, it will be my vacation for this year at the least, I do agree with what many have written on these posts that until you meet the person you really do not know.
Jet...I don't know if I am wrong or not but I don't think the prostitution angle is very big. I agree it is something that these girls have to think about and it does happen but I wonder what the percentage are forced into prostitution. I would think it is low because if it was high word would get around about becoming enslaved. These girls are not dumb.
When I flew into Modova last spring, we landed at same time as a plane from Istanbul, 70-80% were younger girls 20-30's. My guess is they come and go freely. Another thing that they do is buy inexpensive clothing and bring it back to Moldova and sell it. They were opening all luggage, especially flight from Turkey. I got sucked into this mess too...I kept telling women that I was on flight from Germany before she let me leave
PLEASE read the New Yorker article I referenced above.
And be aware that Moldovan schools have compulsory eductaion in just these things. Television runs constant warning too but it STILL happens.
Next time you are in Moldova look up at the billboards. You may not be able to read them but there are billboards on MANY street corners warning girls about traffiking all the TIME!
Joel there are a few things you should keep in mind.
1. Girls travelling with high powered laptops and internet access are not being held in captivity. Shes in Egypt because she wants to be.
2. The girl is being secretive. This would annoy the hell out of me. If she wont tell you what she is doing for a job or even what country she is in, what other things will she be secretive about later?
When/ if you go and see her, you are going to have to be a bit careful. If she smiles and turns on the charm, are you going to be able to think straight? Not many guys do.
I'd never say dont go and see her.
Just proceed with caution. And dont forget plan B
Sorry, jetmba, it doesn't pass the smell test so i don't know why your harping on it. The New Yorker is a magazine which must produce interesting articles every month (week?). What is more interesting than white slavery?
there are a lot of teachers in ukraine who have a child and who don't go to egypt.
They would probably be really happy to meet a nice guy like yourself.
If you could fall in love with a girl who doesn't have stripper good looks
you would probably be much happier.
By the way, if your in a position where your asking why why why. you've already lost the game.
a girl that respects you would never put you in that position. She's just not into you.
move on. be efficient in your search. when you find the right girl it will feel good and natural. It will be open and honest. she will love you as much as you love her. I mean, wouldn't it be nice to hear a girl say, 'why don't you call me more often?'. yeah, you need to get to that place. not this place your currently in.