bgpa,
So, were you using AOB for correspondence?
Becareful before advising people to stay away from sites like AOB, perhaps they were just a mail forwarding agent for the woman and her real agency is located in a city other then what AOB advertises the location of it's affiliate branches ( I think I remember reading about this on their website)
Mine lasted 5 years and change. Similar story to yours, lots of affection prior to getting married, lots of romance, phone calls, visits, flowers, everything's perfect, too good to be true. Then she comes to America, within less than 3 months we get married. From the moment we got married, she started the demands, she wanted to go to college, send money to her parents. I funded her college education, she became a registered nurse. The whole time she was in college, the affection was gradually diminishing (exactly as you described your experience). She was telling me she was occupied with her studying ... then months after she finished college and got a job she filed for a divorce. The only difference between your case and mine is that she did not go after me for alimony (since she makes about fifty grand being a full time nurse).
The pre-nup is not going to save you from heartbreak. These women come here for a single reason: to get a green card, live on your wallet for a while, pursue a profession, help their parents or children if they have any, and they'll drop you like a hot potato once they don't need you anymore. Most people get too excited at first. The first few months go well usually, then it starts going down the drain slowly because she still needs you. When she doesn't need you anymore, it's adios amigos, so long, sayonara for the green card and the good life in America!
She plans to become a citizen in a few months and bring her parents to America, so the whole family will settle here.
My story and yours are not the exception. The exception is when one of these affairs lasts more than 5-6 years. I know three other marriages that ended the same way and ended quicker than mine.
There is no point warning the men in forums like this. I think most men bypass this kind of advice. Once they are in the forums, they have already met someone and the lure is very tempting. I ignored plenty of advice from friends, so I was warned, it's not that people don't have enough warning. People will always do what they want to do.
AOB = scam agency or mail forwarding agency... same thing they prey on western men without regard for deciency. All their pictures are photoshoped and they indulge in profits from swindling honest men out of their money.
Mini cooper,
I agree with your thoughts but does any one know of a introduction/ dating agency that has women who are exclusive to It's site?
What I am saying is, the same women on AOB, are also on AFA, 1st. International Marriage Network, Khersongirls, Elena's models, etc, etc.
Anyone who has half a good memory and anyone who has spent a little time, would notice the same profile photos and wording.
Anyone who has decided to make the trip and visit the ladies they have been writing to, will notice that, in real life the women are different to the altered profile photos.
Has anyone come across this?
Has anyone also noticed that, when you arrive in the woman's city and meet her, her attitude towards you is completely different?
but i also know of successful marriages. so should i come on this site and say that all international marriages are successful. that would be idiotic. and to judge russian women from your one experience is ridiculous.
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Good point!
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none have owned a car and only 2 had their own apt rented
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Let's make fair statistics here - how many of you guys have mortgage paid off?
Came close to my visit there & "POOF" - she disappeared. Email closed. cell phone # changed...she virtually disappeared overnight
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Is not that funny I heard the same stories from the other side? Hundreds of guys send e-mails, speak via phone, web.cam etc... But when time comes to met in person, "his Grandpa passed away" in a best scenario, or he died by himself but delivered that message to addressee... There is no offense against you guys; I do believe in your stories and scamm does exist, but let's be objective and reveal the truth from both sides, making a fair balance- there are no absolute angels from either side.
I just lost a large message I wrote to you and I don't want to re-create it again... but the gist of it was, I have been both scammed and loved by these women and this experience gave me a basic knowledge and understanding of their society. Presently I have a great Ukrainian fiancée and she is a very honest and good person... I was lucky to find her. They (the honest and good women) are there... but far and few between. You must remember that this is a decadent society, built on deceit, lies and distrust… so search carefully and stay away from the glitter sites with photoshoped women... look to the more honest sites to choose your women from... and even those will have many scammers and whores frequenting them…. So my message to you is yes they are worth it if you choose carefully.
One of the problems is that many of you guys dont have the time to invest in developing a relationship. You write the letters, spend at most one to two months then get married. Not ideal preparation for long term marriage. In fact 5 - 6 years is deem about average for any marriage these days.
If you were in a normal situation you would date for 1 - 3 years before getting married. I did it for 4 years. I cant guarantee mine will be a long term success either but if we all worried about failure in all we do we wouldnt marry at all.
Just look at the advice and experience of others to minimise the risk.
You know, I'd like to offer up an alterative, if I may.
Would any of you guys consider living in Ukraine, or Russia, rather than plucking a woman from these countries and hoping she integrates into your country ? Also, the risk of her only wanting you for a Green Card or something, and then, once she has it she goes cold on you, then takes you for everything you've got, is considerably reduced. I understand it's not practical for many guys, but for a few, maybe worth considering ? Even if you could live in your woman's country for one year, this will surely help build the relationship, and maybe weed out a gold digger.
Another thing is the amount of money and time spent writing to women on these 'Dating" sites. If you're loaded and money is no object then okay. Otherwise, maybe a better thing to consider is to save all the money you would spend joining these dating sites, writing to women, paying for video calls, phone calls, sending flowers & gifts and, (we hope not) money, and use that money instead to make frequent trips to Ukraine or Russia. Have no "middle men" in your quest to find your FSU partner, simply keep coming here, meet up with fellow foreigners here, socialise, be seen, learn about the culture, maybe attempt learning the language. The FSU is no different than anywhere else in the sense that a person can often meet either their life-time partner, or even just another person of the opposite sex to spend time with, through mutual friends, the more times you just come here, the more chance of you making friends in your own right, these friends will almost certainly have female friends, and one or two of them will be very interested to meet a foreigner, you !
The money I spent in 2007 paying to read letters, then reply, (Globaladies) then SMS's and phone calls, then travel to Kherson to meet the particular girl who I'd singled out in my mind as possibly "The One" (she wasn't) was almost equal to the amount of money I spent a year later when I used no "Dating" sites and just came to Ukraine for 10 days "blind" as it were. I felt a little alone at first, but I got myself to TGI Friday's in Kiev, had myself an awesome steak meal, heard American English around the restaurant, politely introduced my self to 3 Americans (I'm British) and I'd made friends for the rest of my stay. I visited a further 3 times in 2008 and started a relationship with a nice girl I just met at the Disco, it lasted 8 months.
My current girl (whom I live with here in Ukraine) for example, has many friends. They like very much that she has an "interesting' boyfriend. Some of her friends are single, I'm sure they'd be happy to meet any foreigner that cared to meet them !
We all, of course, must choose the best way for ourselves to achieve our objective; I offer here only MY route.
You guys continue to amaze me at how gullible and affordable you are, then you complain about the cost.
I paid Elenas Models $99 for email and postal addresses and phone numbers. Then every correspondence was outside of the agency, only cost me my Internet connection and a $20-50 international calling card monthly charge.
I corresponded with many very real ladies, using various communication means, and then began an exclusive correspondence with one lady. We agreed to meet, we did, we became engaged, the filed for the visa petition. We continued to get to know each other and agreed not to meet again since our correspondence was of very high quality and quantity.
I am now working a little OT at work while she's at home studying her English as the little sleeps his noon nap.
Those of you who continue to use sites that charge per everything are just throwing your money away; I didn't do that and you can too.
Some of you are very comfortable to spend your money and good luck to you; but most of you end up complaining.
I've actually been thinking about that for a while. I'm learning Russian now as best as I can (going MUCH slower than I thought), and I was considering moving out there for maybe 3-4 months. What's a realistic average monthly cost for living there? Any suggestions or tips?
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What's a realistic average monthly cost for living there? Any suggestions or tips?
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Russia is not a tiny spot on a map as well as USA. Depending on a particular place where you are going to stay at the cost of living would vary significantly. Similar like between Los Angeles and Antilope Village.
So we learn from "Dansing" that to organize a long stay in Russia is going to be more difficult than Ukraine. And of course, a Visa IS required for us Westerners to go there, even for just a day or passing through.
"Muzzy"
You ask about cost of living in Ukraine. What country are you living in ?
I can't speak about the East (no experience) but here in the West I can say that in no way does Ukraine come even remotely close to the extortionately over-priced "Great" Britain.
My flat here is Western styled in its decoration and fitments. Its 2 bed roomed – 1,400RPH a month – current exchange rate = 1GBP to 12.92RPH – so my monthly rent is 108.38GBP. It's impossible to find a garage for rent to park your moped in for this money back there in good ole Blighty, and a flat like this, in a similar sized town, similarly distanced from London to the West, or North, or East, or South, will cost 4 to 5 times more than I'm paying. I pay a further 110RPH on average a month for water and electricity, again, MUCH cheaper than the UK.
I travel everywhere by bus or trolley bus, taxi rarely. 1.50RPH for a bus ride anywhere in the city – 0.80RPH for the trolley – taxi usually 20RPH.
20 Marlboro = 7RPH, the cheapest cigarettes around 4RPH – Disco entry most nights costs 25RPH, and Becks or Stella large around 6RPH.
Food is cheaper, as is pretty much whatever you buy in café's & restaurants.
Flats and houses are WAY WAY WAY cheaper to buy here than the UK.
What does seem to be expensive I've noticed is coffee, clothes and bowling.
These are the financial advantages for us Westerners. The other benefits of being a foreigner in this crazy yet still wonderful country are too many to list here….get your arse over here Muzzy, I feel certain you'll never regret it my friend !!!
To SirDaniel's interesting question -- As much as I love visiting in FSU, the idea of living there has not appealed to me. My home state has important personal connections for me, and is where my career (such as it is) is based. And the air pollution is nasty in the big cities!
But when I fell hopelessly in love with the Ukrainian girl who had no such feelings for me -- during the time when I tried to win her heart -- it became clear that she could not leave Ukraine (because she could not get legal permission to take her child to another country). So I decided that if I COULD win her heart, that I would do my best to live in Ukraine.
What I imagined at the time was returning to the US for a week or two every couple of months (to take care of personal and professional business at home), accumulating about 9 or 10 months per year in Ukraine. I figured it would be rather difficult, but when you love someone with all your heart ...
Staying in Russia is harder, than in Ukraine. For most foreigners, it is not practical to get a visa that allows continuous stay, so what many people do is go for a series of 90-day visas, having to leave Russia each time to obtain a new visa. Even with marriage to a Russian citizen, staying is difficult until you have been married 2 years.
Of course, in both Russia and Ukraine today, unemployment is quite bad. It seems that if you are capable of starting your own business, it isn't very hard to do in Ukraine. I don't have direct knowledge, but I suspect that starting a business in Russia would be much harder -- they impose enourmous paperwork on everything, probably is it necessary to pay some bribes, and unless you keep a very low profile, gangsters will try to squeeze money out of you (not making this up, it is confirmed by Russian business people I have met).
I appreciate what Frank went through. I was the victim of a scam that was a cheap education by comparison. I'm a novice, and know it. I wouldn't even venture to speak to his experience. I've nothing to say except that I'm not going to make the same mistake twice. If I get involved with a woman on this site, it's going to take awhile before I'm going to "take it to the next level." I made the cardinal mistake of sending money to a woman (?) there's no way to prove it one way or another. I will speak to my experience, if a man gets burned because of the obvious "entrylevel" scams, he'd quit and consider it an education well earned. Cut your losses and move on. That's what I'm going to do. I don't know if I'll continue here or not. But what I do know, is that I'm going to stick with my owm kind. Jews are alot of things but one thing that their not is economic refugees. My next move will be with the Jewish Site I'm currently a member on, like here just a basic member. It takes awhile to "dive back in," once you've been played, and at that with such and obvious trick. I'm grateful to the Lord for unanswered prayers. Think what hell I'd have put myself through if I'd made the mistake of marrying this person, if there even was one in the first place. Frank, I really wish you well, and hope you eventually find a woman that's worthy of your love and devotion. I'll leave you with one tidbit, that I've been doing alot of "submitting my ego," in order to partake of. Go to "Doubleyourdating.com," and check it out, if your so inclined.
Sir Daniel, you talk a lot of sense, and much of what you write is very informative, but reference your earlier posting I can't understand how these girls get their hands on all the niceties which are so expensive for them to afford on their own wages. I have been in the boutiques, beauty salons and phone shops with these girls and have seen the huge choice of clothes and fashion accessories on offer at very expensive prices (for them) and I have wondered how these girls accumulate such a vast wardrobe on such miniscule salaries?? and they claim to work such long hours... when do they find the time to do all that shopping?? I've seen clothes and jewellery collections which would take them until their pension to amass
As for starting business in Russia/Ukraine it is the most horrible idea that could ever sparkle foreigner's mind. Besides bureaucraucy what means tons of paperwork, bribery and extortion are there that make absolute impossible any honest business.