Wife seeker, When a person writes in Ukrainian, The translator program tries to interpret words into Russian and they come out as verbal crap. I have seen this on happen to me from a Ukrainian girl. who preferred to speak and write in Ukrainian. Had a hell of a time trying to make sense out of it.
4re_geo - SAVE YOUR GIFTS. You don't even know if you like each other yet.
You say you've 'sent' flowers. Never trust a dating agency to send flowers. Most of the time the lady never actually gets the flowers. (They may take a photo of her in the florist shop posing with the flowers but the flowers stay there and the agency pockets the money.) If you must send flowers use a flower delivery company that is not a dating agency. I personally prefer to buy the flowers myself and put them into her own hand. That's the only way you know she is truly getting them.
Going to a great deal of expense on gifts on the first meeting may not necessarily be wise. Let's say she doesn't like you and she doesn't want to see you again. I would wait until the relationship develops further before presenting gifts. There are women in Ukraine and it's sad to say that are gift collectors. They meet many men and are in it for the gifts, the restaurants, etc. but they are not really interested in a relationship with you that will lead to marriage.
TomZ: I sent her flowers directly to her address both times (using, as you suggested, a well-known, locally based flower delivery company). I asked for her address and she gave it to me from the beginning. She got the flowers, I have her picture with them at the entrance of her apartment.
You may be right about expensive gifts the first time but perhaps for different reasons. She had the opportunity to ask for something and she passed. She has told me everything about her. I am an experienced person and I have made my conclusions about her. Our conversations have covered everything including our meeting. Our interactions are intimate and very warm. I do not anticipate surprises. And, I might add that I am quite a likable person:) It will be a little difficult with the language barrier. She has started English lessons with a private teacher (she pays for it). I am looking at electronic translators, as well. Any suggestions? I've also learned a few Russian words and phrases. She is interested in marrying me very much. She is preparing the necessary documents and translations to hand them to me when we meet. I will pass them along with many pictures to my attorney as soon as I am back. I think I know what I'm getting her for present:)
I enjoyed the comments on your blog on how a western man should conduct himself and what Ukrainian woman expects from a meeting; what should a westerner expect from a Ukrainian woman in the same situation?
thank you for your feedback and for your question.
Honestly speaking, it's hard to answer it. As you can read on my welcome page http://ukrwom.wordpress.com/ "Not all Ukrainian men can understand us Ö I will tell you even more Ö Not always can we understand ourselves:)"
When a woman goes on a date, she has certain expectations due to cultural and social background. I touched upon the topic in this post http://wp.me/p4DpVL-K. What will be a reaction of a woman? This is a difficult question. Even if you ask a girl, how she would react if... She may say one thing and when it happens, she will act in a different way. I discussed this topic several days ago with 2 women. They said about themselves "Sometimes I cannot understand, why I act the way I do. I don't understand, why I want one thing, the next moment I want another thing and then I don't want anything etc." It all depends on the physiology of women. At us everything is not stable, we react immediately on the weather, on the absence of the sun, on the words and looks of strangers in a bus and many other things you would never pay attention to.
When a woman meets a foreign man... Sometimes her behaviour depends on the instructions given by her agency or by her "experienced friends". Yes, some women would come in a short skirt and with bright make-up and it doesn't mean that they are bad or that they are prostitutes. I am sure that you all know that in animal world males are brighter then females, they always have a kind of competition in order to get females. The same situation in Ukraine with women. There are less men than women, so there is a competition between women to find a man. The most common way to compete is making themselves more beautiful with a help of bright make-up and clothes. I've seen the girls, who wear formal suits on a date. I've met the girls, who had nearly no make-up. But make-up and clothes will not tell you a lot about her character. You should talk to her, spend a lot of time before you can predict at least some of her reactions.
I wish you patience. Don't go on a date being programmed on "meeting one more prostitute" (then why did you come???) If you want one - look for her in your country, if you really want to find a girlfriend - get ready to spend a lot of time on understanding her and be open to exploring her inner world.
Lonely, i'm so sorry for you :)
4re_geo, yes we know prada and all other stuff here, do you think we still live in some huts, and singing anthems around the fire? Ukraine is an European country! :)
about a gift, if she's really shy girl like you've said, she would know that prada purse is an expensive gift and she might not want to take it. But if she's not very shy - she'll take it :)
I did not want to give you suggestions on gifts as you did not ask me or anyone but Ukrainian Woman.
Now you have me a bit worried. Your girl wants to marry you and she has not even met you in person or known you for months? Oh dear, well I hope she is alright.
With my girl, I am a bit like you, besotted. I spend the time paying her compliments, telling her how much I like her etc. and she is not just going to tell me she is madly in love with me until she does (if she does). She is amazingly level headed for a girl of her age (more than me probably) and that may be because she has already been married and divorced. She learned the hard way. She is not going to say that she wants to marry me, she will wait until I pop the question and I am not going to do it until we are sure of each other. Even then, there is no guarantee that she will say yes. In the meantime she asks for nothing or gets nothing from me (money wise).
I need to remind you, and others here, that the courting process with FSU girls is exactly the same as with women of your own country. It is just that the media and Western women want to make it look like it is a question of picking a girl from a catalogue and then she will marry you.
4re_geo that might be an expensive way to find out how she really looks if you are unable to Skype with video. Flower company snaps a pic of her receiving the flowers at her apartment entrance. It's also a way to verify that she actually exists and you're not chatting with some site operator.
I'd have to agree with WS that if she's already proposing marriage even before the first meeting something is amiss. That would set off a red ribbon as some other gentleman said.
Remember this: before she becomes your wife she has to become your girl friend and before she becomes your girl friend she has to become your friend. Quickly to marriage quickly to divorce.
Normal courting which leads to marriage usually takes one to two years of getting to know each other.
moyarishska: I have not been to Ukraine for a very long time. When I was there, some brands were known and some were not (e.g., Prada was not known). Yes! Ukraine is a European country. Thanks for the suggestions! I am pretty sure she'll accept the present.
Wifeseeker: Of course, I have not proposed .. we want to be with each other and it is mutual. We have discussed about many things that I will not mention in a forum. She is quite younger than me, but she is not a "daughter bride". She is a mature person and knows very well what she's doing. It is incredible how quickly it developed. It is not believable to others, but this is of little importance. All that matters is what she and I believe:) I will keep you posted. I wish your upcoming trip goes well!
What Ukrainian Woman said above: "if you really want to find a girlfriend - get ready to spend a lot of time on understanding her and be open to exploring her inner world". This is a very wise statement! It is the key to her heart! My time is very precious. I have been investing my time generously trying to understand and explore the inner world of one girl and only one girl. Her nationality is less relevant, she's a woman, and if she's genuine, she has needs and desires from a relationship, you have to discover what are her needs and make her feel that you are the man who can fulfill them. For you too, it can be a fun and very emotionally satisfying process if you are really interested in her.
TomZ: I said that we communicate 2-3 times a week on Skype always with video, 2-3 hours each time. I appreciate that she makes an effort to show me how she actually is in her real life. She does not put make-up and does not wear anything flashy. In fact, we have seen each other so many times that it is not about looks anymore. I do not care that much how she looks, I know how she looks. I just enjoy her company, chatting and joking and laughing together. If there was no big time difference, we could be spending four and five hours in these video calls, time just flies.
Neither she nor I have proposed. We are very compatible and have feelings for each other. I know a whole lot about her and she knows a whole lot about me. We are both mature and have good judgement. Many people marry for all the wrong reasons in our country. If we marry, it will not be for the wrong reasons. It does take about a year for the visa to be issued. She is already my girlfriend:)
I missed something, how do you chat with your girl for up to 3 hours if she barely speaks English? Ho does she understand your jokes?
The thing about what they wear when you meet them or see them, applies to the genuine ones. My girl put studio photos on her profile that made her look like a top model, then when we started talking she sent me mobile phone and ordinary photos of her with no make up and clothes she wears to go to buy food. When we met she never bothered to wear sexy or glamorous clothes, just her every day clothes; she put on make up once or twice.
I never bothered to speak to her on video before I met her. As it turned out, her complexion is not perfect but so what, she is young and beautiful. When she met me in person she problaby thought: "he looks rougher than in his photos". She did not complain.
I'm asking you to generalize again: With what looks like to be a civil war looming in Ukraine, do you think ladies would be more willing to relocate with western man and do you think women that would've considered a foreign husband are now considering it now?
I can only assume what people feel in the center of all terrible events in the Eastern Ukraine, as I live on the South of Ukraine. Life goes on here. We work, go for a walk, everything is as usual. Donít think that all over Ukraine people shoot in the center of a city. Yes, we feel that economic situation is worse and worse, yes, food becomes more and more expensive, while our salaries either stay on the same level or people are not paid at all.
During the last months I havenít met any girl, who decided to register in the marriage agency because of the problems in Ukraine. But itís hard for me to evaluate the situation, as I have nothing to do with any of the agencies.
It would be logical to say that for some of the girls it will become a reason (if earlier they had some doubt) to go to a marriage agency. It can also make women more decisive, they will do everything quicker (learn a language, prepare documents etc).
I have many Ukrainian friends in Facebook and I keep in touch with a number of girls in the dating site I used. None of them have told me anything about being needy or in a hurry to leave Ukraine because of the situation. In fact, they play it down, so as not to put off men like me from going to visit them out of fear.
This includes girls in Lugansk, Donetsk and Odessa.
I am interested to see your take on the photos that appear in the ladies profiles. My view is that if one looks carefully in the genuine dating sites, there are many beautiful ladies who did no bother to go and have those studio photo shoots with them in glamorous poses, with few clothes and fully made up. These girls just put some home made photos where they look 'ordinary'. In my view these girls are little gems and good to approach them as you will have a lot less competition for them than the model looking ones, in the studio photos. Men go for the most glamorous and sexy looking ones.
I once met in person a girl who had a set of amazing glamorous studio photos in her profile. In person she looked rather ordinary and she even had bad complexion.