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	Create New Topic   My Posts   My forum buddies   Invite friends   Private messages Russian brides > Main Forum > Women who reply without reading letter... Author Post olafur Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/8/2004 9:57:58 PM   Greetings from Iceland and thank you all for a good forum:) I have been writing to few women( like probably most of us here) and in some cases in their first reply they ask questions about what I work and my intrests and everything good about that , the ting is that in my first letter I allready told about myself in good details and I have the feeling that they did not boather reading my letter..How is it guys? do they answer most letters they get in that way and just see where things lead?..or do they carefully select thoase they decide to write to? I would very much like to get comment from more experianced guys on this forum.. jjbarrier Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/8/2004 11:12:02 PM   I know there have been comments about this subject before, it's hit or miss. I think there are cultural differences that lead to frustrations, on one hand it seems that many women see Western men as strangers and they don't really open up in their letters until a closer relationship has formed, let's say after the man has come to visit them. I have had women ask me when I was planning on visiting them after 3 letters. Western men on the other hand mostly want to form the relationship through writing letters first, so we have different expectations. I also think women in general have little concept of how difficult it is for us to make a trip, and how time consuming. I have been on this forum about 8 months now, and have had exchange of letters with about 70 or 80 women, and only a handful really developed into any meaningful dialogue. I don't know how others have fared, all I can say is - don't give up, eventually you will find someone with whom you will connect. shaggy47435 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/8/2004 11:44:37 PM   Yes jj you are right about that. Olafur, It happens very often that the agency will automatically send out a reply for many ladies that is genneral in nature. It is also common for agencies to call women and read short letters to them on the phone and then take a letter back to you of course based on their memory of the letter read to them. Some get a print out and take it home to study and reply while maybe sending a canned note. It is all very confusing at first but after awhile you will get use to it. It took one girl almost 4 letters before she actually came in and saw my pictures and answered my questions from earlier letters. Some I think are just like us canvasing several to find the one. Also many from the smaller towns might only make the trip once or twice a month. The rest are by phone. With all the different agencies and policies and methods it could be anything. Also see the other threads as we have found many other little things and scammers as well. My best advice to you is use your best judgement. Give them a few letters to start to get more personal. The best thing is to look for their interest in you. Don't be afraid to ask them for their personal contact information and beware the infomercials. If they are asking the same questions again and again most likely they don’t remember who you are because they are writing too many people. Or they are canned letters from agencies wanting to make some money off fiancé.com for our responses. Look out for the Miss Wows as they are the most written to ladies most likely because the are the ones sending out mass mailings and sales pitches. I am sure I have said too much and left just as much out so I will shut up and let some of the others speak. Again there are lots of threads on repeats and other little issues. Just takes some time to dig. Good luck! jmoluv Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/9/2004 12:20:58 AM   olafur, welcome. i thought iceland had plenty of beautiful scandinavian ladies up there. please tell me if it is true? about the replys you are describing ? well , you will see enough in the past threads of me venting about it. enough said jmo felicedate Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/9/2004 8:48:46 AM   Olafur, it depends on the letter itself... May be you have written like most guys do "I work for the prosperous moving company as a manager", believe me that most guys think that it is very clear from the first sight what you do, but actually understand that we live in two different worlds and there are some jobs and realities here that it will take not just one letter to understand. If she askes you "to tell about your job", do not see a pitfall in this. tell her where it is situated, how far it is from your hme, how many people there are there, what you are doing in details, describe your particular work spot and your aims. You all complaint of canned letters but most guys use them also and especially when talking about family, work and so on. And very often it sounds very formal and cold. Women also want to know you more personally. As for the meeting and who wants what. The problem is that some of you guys want just writing. You will never confess but 80% of you will end this without anything more than writing to "60-70 ladies". By the way this is very frustrating to the girls. Most of them are tired of people like jj who write endless letters for months and although he might be brilliant speaker, intelligent person and so on but anyone will be fed up with this sooner or later. In our practice the best results are according to the following scheme: Writing letters 2,5-3,5 months(not more. Meeting here in Belarus(I don't know if you think it is really this hard, we organize everything in a week and totally it usually costs to a man about 2,5-3,5 thousands including airfair to go for 7-12 days here. I am not giving my oppinion if it is expencive or not. Judge yourself) Usually this week clears things out very quickly and either two people cry at the airport of despair because they do not want to leave each other or the girl asks us to let her not accompany the man to the airport. But this happened just once because the guy turned out to be ... to be politically correct.... enourmously overweight!:-) After this meeting usually both people agree what to do next themselves, we do onot interfere anyhow. Some continue writing and meet again and again, so immediately decide to start the process of getting a visa for her... Now some insight on the other way of behaviour. We have several clients that are extremely frustrated because in a year(!) they had up to 20 cases when a man appeares , writes, reads asks her telephone number and so on and finally either dissapeares or she really askes him "What next?" and he decides that he is not ready for thisserious step in this life, he is too young(some 45:-) or has no money and so on... Well by the way, for some reasons many men start all this even not realizing that all the process will cost not less than some 10.000. I have met many such "business owners" who finally informed the girl that they are no longer able to pay 30$ a month for the fiance.com membership and want her to use private e-mail. What is sad that most girls really do not understand what it means and agree to pay themselves not to lose the person whom they really began to like... And we with pain in heart have to explain that there is no use writing to such a guy as it will lead to nowhere anyway. And it is not truth that women are more often insisting on meeting, you judge by yourself. Men usually propose meeting sooner but what is sad too many do not read thsi forum and again and again tell "Come to me in America" giving enough space for possible scam. It is impossible to go to the US unless you are a fiance or an exchange student! Simple formula. jmoluv Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/9/2004 9:45:34 AM   felice, that was an excellent thread. it is good to see the other side of the coin. i got burned out real quick after 4 months of letters and flew over to meet a couple of ladies i was writing to and also attended a social. this type of adventure is not for one who might be struggling to make financial ends meet at home. GEMACH Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/9/2004 10:18:28 AM   Yes, felicedate, it may be a good idea to travel as quick as possibile to Russia to see them in nature. But for my part, I'm living in Austria, 2,5-3,5 thousands are almost a quarter of an average west-european annual income. So you see, it's in fact not so easy just to step to Russian, have a look there for some girls (which mostly live in very different areas) and drive back home. Doing this for about three times in two years and you will have a small problem with your account. I'm sure, that's one of the reasons, why men want to write a lot of letters first, cut down the number of really interesting girls to a reasonalbe amount of about 5 to max. 10 and than decide to travel there; and not the other way round. I know for example, that the average income in Australia is almost 3 times higher than in west-europe!!! And you may believe it or not, the air-fare ist nearby the same, if you go from vienna to moscow or form N.Y. to moscow! And hotels in Russia are very, very expensive! shaggy47435 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/9/2004 10:37:16 AM   Again just a point that $10,000 is less than most pay for their junker car. To say you cannot do this without being well off is not so. What it takes is commitment, and desire to succeed. I cannot believe that anyone truly wanting this to happen could not make the sacrafices to do this. Again money makes it easier but it is possible with simple planning to find these kinds of funds. I think the key point is that many just are not really wanting to make that step and yes it is a problem. Another is there are those on both sides exploiting these issues. Yes from both sides. I can honestly say that my experience is the odds are about the same here or there for happiness or dissapointment. I am not a rich man and yes I am one of the overweight folks here in the US! :-) I hope that they are looking at my pictures! Many have told me it does not really matter that "a good man must be big" and a few simply say they want me to be big so as to be like stone wall! I take it is some kind of quote or saying as many girls have shared it with me. I no matter what I will always have a linemans build. I use to be enourmously overweight but now I am just fat! Some here know that I have lost almost 105 lbs and still chugging along. There is very little information regaurding our success rates as larger people and yes that is part of my problem with the socials but again I have seen the videos that even the heavies have fun at socials. I do understand that womens views on such are similar but again I seem to be doing ok and I have been very honest upfront about my size and modest lifestyle. But hey everyone knows what a sweetheart I am....lol. Again felice we do appreciate your input as many here had run out of information to share and yes many of us are convinced there could be major improvement with little effort we still enjoy the service and experiences with folks like you that seem to take your job seriously. felicedate Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/9/2004 10:54:24 AM   Gemach. I see what you mean. Really this "adventure" is not too cheap, although you can always find a desired solution. Some people prefer to spend some 4-5 hndreds more and do not spend time on organizing the trip themselves. Some count every dollar and do everything themselves saving perhaps and may be even saving much, this is the matter of how much you have in your pocket. By the way, Moscow is not Russia - hotel rooms are expencive only in St.Petersburg and Moscow. In ordinary cities hotels are much cheaper than you can imagine. Even in S.Petersburg it is normal to rent very fashionable appartments for 50-60$ a night on the Nevsky ave. There are some cheap hotels there that rent rooms for only 5$ a night! Of course they are for tourists from this country, as we normally take the conditions. I just say that if you want to save - you will. Another question is how it looks from HER side... Russian people are although not rich but very very generous. Jmo, I am not familiar with that socials. We had a couple offers to "invite your girls to the meeting and we will pay you 4$ for each" but for me this smells not good. With the same success you can go to a nearby bar and try to start on a girl there. I think that those who attend such meetings are either in despair or very well know what they want. A characteristic feature of a stereotype russian girl most of you are looking for is modesty. If a girl agrees to go to such a meeting she is showing in public many things that you will not understand not knowing our mentality. This is normal for young girls(they are americanized) but I can hardly believe that a decent girl older than 27 will go there, she will burn of shame!:-) GEMACH Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/9/2004 1:14:04 PM   Felicedate. I'm usually generous too; being greedy is definitely not my way of life. But I was always wondering how quick some girls have been asking me, when I will see them the first time. And yes, I like traveling and I usually live in all countries I visit only a little bit better than the people from the visited area. I'm doing this not because of the money, I'm doing it because I want to know the people and there conditions. In fact I have at least three cities to visit my favourite five girls there; but all the city are in very great distance from each other. So I'm sure, I've to do three journeys: 3*3,000 $ ... Perhaps some of you guys starts to think a little bit. Some of you are always struggling about the expectations of the Russian girls how the money in the western world is growing on trees; but what about ourselves? I - for my part - have the honesty to say that I can not afford 10,000 $ within only one year to do some journeys. And my income is west-european middle-class. What about you? Does it really not matter for men with american average income or is money only not allowed to be a matter? GEMACH Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/9/2004 1:24:42 PM   Felicedate, may I mail you directly for some questions for a trip to vitebsk. It seems you have a quite good knowledge of the situation there ... Thanks. felicedate Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/9/2004 1:51:40 PM   Gemach, you are welcome for sure but remember that I am in this business!;-) It is always possible to negotiate. I think you see my e-mail in the forum? And... In comparisson with Russia, money DO grow on trees!:-) My fiance last paycheck for a month morking as a teacher was about 70$! This is a hooby not a job. shaggy47435 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/9/2004 2:15:22 PM   felice maybe not even a hobby but a "free lunch for two". I would not mind you sending me your agency information as well. Gemach. I think you can do it if you realy want it. But you may have to slow your pace. Why not maybe concentrate your funds and efforts to one city. I have the same delima that my time does not allow me to travel as often or as long. You have to follow your gut on this one as it seems there is no magic bullet. I know some agencies with the social approach that claim 80% lead to marriage for a membership and one social. They where on Fox news and are american owned. The work out of the super cold mining towns of the mid north. If you don't get married they will refund your $500 or so membership. Now that is service with a guarantee. But again how can you put a time and monetary value on something like this. In reality I think you would spend as much on a girl here to court and lead to marriage as well so pick your poision and hope we can afford one that goes down easy...sorry that pun was not intended...lol shaggy47435 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/9/2004 3:42:23 PM   poison that is...lol felicedate Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/9/2004 5:30:41 PM   Interesting, I see you guys have a new toy in face of those "socials". I have seen this also on TV only so can't judge. The only thing I know for sure is that I would not be in a place where there is a single prostitute on the equal rights with the others. This is somehow below my level and I think most of my clients' level. It looks too cheap and it tars the very idea of finding "one and only". But it is again your choice and may be a good back up plan if the girl you meet is much uglier than in the photo!:-) For my liking I would imagine other ways to ensure yourself. If you are coming somewhere with an agency, usually it is normal if they can invite some girls in different times to introduce you to them and them to you. It is also not too beautiful but better than these fun-parties. Tim, now I remember you. Sveta was long after asking if you wrote something to her or not. I was not familiar with her correspondence as it was one of our girl's sphere so I have not even seen your profile. As for the contact info, my e-mail is probably shown in this forum. What I will never do is talking about our site, this is not fair, all our clients are present here as for all the rest - always ready to discuss. olafur Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/9/2004 9:06:16 PM   Thank you all for intresting discussion. jjbarrier Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/9/2004 9:31:18 PM   Felicedate - it is obvious that you have an agenda, and therefore present your point of view the way you do. SINCE you make a living at this, you are obviously interested in getting guys to come as quickly as possible, and most likely get commission on all kinds of stuff. I saw firsthand in Moscow how Western men get fleeced at every turn, and you people are not even ashamed of it. While I was quoted a price of 500 rubles for a taxi fare my lady got the same ride for 140, and there were several other instances like that. It's up to everyone how they want to approach their search, but I for one believe that we all have a tremendous responsibility, towards the ladies who we are about to uproot and bring into our world, and ourselves. If it turns out badly, its a terrible thing for those parties involved, except people like you who already collected their share of the proceeds. I did not claim to speak for all men, but merely shared my experience. I am not one of those who wrote endless letters, and then disappeared, but got tired of getting irrelevant letters from women. I have written NOT ONE canned letter, all my letters I wrote to women were making specific references to things they wrote in their own profile. I proposed a meeting to a lady I liked after about 2 - 3 months of intensive dialogue, and have recently returned from Moscow from my first meeting, and will go to Ekaterienburg next March because we liked each other. So I do believe I speak with some measure of insight here. As I said in my above response, I believe there are genuine cultural differences that cause women and men to view the significance of the correspondende differently, unless we can overcome those it will only lead to more. Gemach, I am an AUstrian myself, living in the US, if I can be of assistance feel free to e-mail me. Good luck to you. felicedate Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/10/2004 6:37:50 AM   JJ. It is your point and your experience. If you have read my words more carefuly there you would find that 1) The reccomended term of writing before meeting is 2,5-3,5 Not more but not less. it is silly to come to visit her in a week. Why then you accuse me on making you guys come as quick as possible while you yourself repeat my words? 2)Read everything I have written. In one thread I have written that Moscow - is not Russia. This is the separate state and hte third most expencive place in the world. Does this make any sense to you? I myself just hate that city because people are trashy there and want to deceive you on every step, steal something or things of the kind. Even when I have to go there on business for one day it is so that I spend not less than 300-400$ in just one day there without transportation charges. This city lives on fooling "lohs"(people who can be fooled). When you come to Ekaterinburg or to any other city you would see that it is not so harsh there. For example I just adore St.Petersburg and my advise to everyone is to visit it. Among Russians Moscow is called "a big market" so judge yourself. There if you make business you must be principless and even cruel otherwise you won't survive. Just for your information. Next week a guy from Austria is coming to Belarus to meet our client and we are making zero on this. Just because it was his and her wish and believe me that we will give him such a heap of advise how to save his money and secure himself that it can't but help. JJ. You know, you seem to be offended somehow and the best way out is to offend someone in responce. Not the best way to my mind. In my practice usually even a guy and a man do not feel compatible he then anyway continues communicating with us just because he finds friends in our face. Pitty, that it wasn't so with you. wtrav02 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/10/2004 9:15:38 AM   jjbarrier, you're right about two prices, one for foreigners and one for locals, but isn't this the case in every poor part of the world? the prices that were quoted here do not seem ourageous at all. I know a gentleman in Kiev who rented me apartments and provided other services, he never tried to rob me, he even gave me advice and we are good friends since then. It is better to have someone you know to provide the services, even knowing through a forum, than going completely in the dark. The guy here said who he is, the administrator of this site recognized him, so you know he's for real, he told you the prices, you can compare, he told you he'd be willing to negotiate, there is nothing wrong doing business and making a profit on your honest efforts. jjbarrier Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 12/10/2004 10:24:57 AM   Felicedate - perhaps I over reacted, but I was indeed offended when you commented on ladies getting tired of guys like me writing letters without you knowing anything about what was communicated. If I accused you wrongly of wanting to make a quick buck - my apologies, I was not trying to say that you specifically are lacking integrity, but it's no secret that there are plenty of people in this business -not necessarily agency owners or employees - that are less than honest. Your Reply: Your name:   New Registration Password:   Forgot password?   refresh Code:   Russian brides > Main Forum > Women who reply without reading letter...
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