And to echo everybody else,
In my years of letter writing I never actually met with a lady in an FSU neutral capital city, despite a number of ladies suggesting to do so, because those correspondences fizzled out before reaching that stage, none of those ladies were serious.
All the serious, or semi serious, ladies I met with were happy to meet in their own cities, indeed were often complimented that I was prepared to travel and 'rough it' in their home cities.
If she is not from Kiev, don't arrange to meet her in Kiev!. Go to her home town and if she does not want you to go and see her in a home town..forget her and drop it and move on.
To echo Martin, there are scammers in the real flesh who will scam at the personal meeeting with "an all expenses shopping and holiday trip paid for out of your wallet before you get the ingracious dumping"
I personally don't recommend correspondence/involvement with girls from Kiev, Moscow or St. Petersburg as these girls live in a very much "Westernised and developed enviroment" and a far more "materialistic" and will expect a lot from you but scammers can come from anywhere.
The fact she does not want to meet in her home town of Mariupol and will only want to meet in Kiev is a very big negative sign...like what has been said a real FSU girl will want you to meet her family in her home town and get there approval to marry her..they are very family orientated and many adult girls still live in apartments with there mother, father and siblings..it is the culture and the way things are done there.
Like Martin said, I too have had the experience of many "correspondence fizzle outs based on the premise of meeting in another city than there hometown and it suggests such ladies are not serious at all or not genuine"
If you want to go to Kiev make sure you have a back-up plan to meet other ladies or to the ladies hometown a back-up plan to meet other ladies as you can't risk thousands of dollars of expenses in travel etc. on the basis of meeting one lady only and hoping it goes well because it probably won't..it likes playing lotto and putting on a big wager to win the million dollar first prize..it won't happen in all likely chances so have a back-up plan when you travel.
Very few meetings will work out with any foreign woman as it is a shot in the dark..a blind date until you meet and she could go "yuk" to you or vice versa.
For once I retract my earlier statements about multiple trips and meetings to the FSU..I agree with Marti and others here "multiple trips and meetings in this foreign search for a woman to marry business"..it will be necessary to do this and be prepared for failures..its like going down to the lotto office and buying tickets every week for the Saturday draw..be prepared to loose your money and not win at all time after time.
And it will take years to win just as it takes years to win lotto..the win being to find your compatable woman from overseas if at all.
You can reduce your chance of failure on each trip to the FSU by having a back-up plan of more than one woman youcan meet ( but you don't tell any of the girls you are going to meet that you will be meeting others..thats a sure fire way to getting dumped at the first meeting as there noses will really be out of joint by that..be a good liar and keep a straight face and don't let on or hint you are meeting more than one girl and are playing the field as they will not understand! )..its not a recipe for success but it might make the trip less of a waste..never put all your eggs in one basket because these girls don't!
Very few men from the internet end up meeting a foreign woman from the internet and getting married and living happily ever after...yes it does happen but not that often and there is a lot of luck involved and a lot of trips, time and money too..be prepared to have time and resources to do this and keep all your other options at home open too!
Its interesting to note, the US embassy in Moscow receives on average 10 complaints a day from its citizen men about scams in the FSU and men being duped into paying for an all expenses paid shopping trips/holidays by some dishonest FSU girls and the scamming of money for air plane tickets, visas and fake medical expenses from US men.
Wake up and smell the coffee!
Aussieman,
Interesting, many guys think the winning lotto ticket is sitting there and waiting for them, these guys are facing a reality check, an expensive one at that, you are quite correct in what you say regarding this subject.
Aussieman
"Moscow recieves about 10 complaints a day"
Men that get conned by these women are the funniest people. They can be perfectly sensible in every other way.
A woman friend of mine, was speeking to a guy, just last week, who was scammed out of $2000. He now has been getting letters from other women?? he doesnt know why.-)))
She read one of the new letters and there was nothing personal in them, but they were already talking about needing $500. The funny thing is he is already more than half way thinking of sending the money.
Just how supid can these people be.
Can these people be helped?
Do you know people are still taken in by those Nigerian scams?
I would have thought they would be too embarrassed about their own stupidity, to complain about it.
>I agree with Marti and others here "multiple trips and meetings in this foreign search for a woman to marry business"..it will be necessary to do this and be prepared for failures..its like going down to the lotto office <
Multiple trips is ok for Martin he lives in England and could go to the Eastern Block every few weeks. From far away countries like New Zealand, you seriously cant consider more than a few trips a year.
I wouldnt bother going unless I thought there was a good chance of success. I think if you know what you want, you would be unlucky if you fail.
Australia is just next door to New Zealand in the same neighbourhood so Aussies can't afford multiple trips to the FSU either...not with average $40,000 per year working salaries before tax, 30% + income tax rates, $4,000 return airfars to say Kiev from Australain eastern capital cities where most of us live, and only 74 US cents for each Aussie dollar exchange rates.
It costs a lot of money and what is reitterated in this thread "It is stupid to travel to another country and only have one woman lined up to meet based on e-mail correspondence"
You need to have a back-up plan, more than one woman arranged to meet, personally I think you need to meet at least 6 or more girls, one on one in the same city you are travelling too, but it is no guarantee of success but at least you are buying more chances to succeed, just like buying more than one lotto ticket and the trip will not be suh an expensive waste.
For an Australian the exercise of travel, meeting and expenses of going to the FSU will be at least $10,000 and it might cost an American $5,000..still it is a lot of money to spend to meet just one woman and hope it all works out because generally it will not work and you will loose and you can't travel to the FSU every week, every time you fail unless you are a millionaire and 99.9% of people in this forum are not such people.
But its like buying bingo tickets..I can buy a set of 6 books that covers all 90 numbers in a game and still not win and someone can buy 2 books covering only 30 out of 90 numbers and win with the right number combination..there is a lot of luck here involved and my bingo books only cost $6 per book..its a far cry for spending $10,000 on a trip just to meet one woman..see my point people!
I can't really travel to Ukraine as often as I like, despite my location, as I need to work for a living and cannot take any more time off work than a guy from USA or NZ.
And with the rise in fuel prices flights are becoming more expensive, I'm back to Dnepropetrovsk in July and the air fares alone are around GBP375.
And anyone paying USD4,000 from eastern Oz to Kiev needs a reality check, just as an example London to Kiev is less than USD400 return and Eastern Oz to London ain't nothing like the remaining USD3,600.
Aussie
If I am to fly 20,000km to see a women. I want to be pretty damned certain that there is going to be a sweet little honey, with a big smile on her face, waiting for me at the airportwhen I arrive. I wouldnt go for six lotto tickets, or even a hundred.
Martin
From our part of the world it takes about two days to get to Kiev, so normally you have to overnight somewhere on the way there and on the way back. So yes, then it does cost around $4000Aus and the price is going higher. When you get there your shattered, your time clock is out, so that you cant sleep or stay awake. It takes most people days to recover or even a week. So when you go, you have to stay for at least 3-4 weeks to make it worth while. Thats why no one, no matter how rich, do more than 2 or 3 trips a year
I did the "honerable" one woman thing. In fact it was great, we met several times, spent time with each other, got engaged and she even came to USA and we were to get married. But it never worked out and she went back unfortunatly for reasons I will not share here.
This time I am doing it differently. I am going for a month and I have 8 ladies that I have developed good relations with. I'm not betting the pot on one woman. Ive done it already, Ive been to where I am going several times. I now have established contacts that know me and I have used, I have a few friends there also. and you better believe it when I say that these girls I am going to see are genuine and they will be there waiting to meet me. The only part that kind of sucks is I have to pick only one =(
Do whatever you have to do to be sure they are real and genuinely interested in you. It is possible. Dont expect to have someone take you by the hand to show how its done. Live and learn
After reading all this ... I've come to realize that I have no hope of making this work. The cost from the US, multiple trips, etc.... will be thousands and thousands of dollars. I'm just a normal guy with a normal job. sigh
hussar, you can throw 10's of thousands of dollars at this and it wont work. I know of a few guys that were lucky on the first trip, but they did return 1 or 2 more times before their wives arrived. You really have to research this whole thing and don't believe everything people say or what you read on the internet. These women arent just wanting to get out and they will live happily here. "mail order brides" Its a myth. Maybe when the fall of the soviet union and this whole internet dating thin started 10-11 years ago it was more true, I don't know. These women are smart. I'm talking about the serious ones. In my experience meeting these ladies they dont want to come here for a so- so life. They can have that at home. Their not necssarily looking to hit the lottery, but you had better be able to provide a good life for her. Thats my own opinion, im sure someone dosent agree but it will in no way change my outlook.
#1 she is not going to work legally for 1 year so you had better have the cash to support her AND spend time with her. If youo think your going to leave her to look at 4 walls while you work all day you will find out thats not going to work
#2 she WILL need a car unless you live in the city
#3 she is going to be 100% dependent on YOU until she assimilates into society so its ALL you.
#4 she is after all a woman and she is going to want to shop- fact of life, accept it
#5 she will miss her family and if you make the mistake of telling here she cant go home to visit cuz you cant afford it. Forget it right now and stop lookin cuz your done.
Now, unlike alotta guys that have been over there a million times and are professors of knowledge about what its like thet, thats great for them. Ive done all that plus Ive had a woman here already so I speak from experience at that stage as well.
And dont forget all the love and attention on top of all that, she will want 100% of it while you are her only lifeline here
if you can find a girl thats right for you then thats what its all about. I wish anyone doing what we are the best of luck, because you will need it just like the rest of us