I wonder if you can give me some advice.
I have been chatting with a woman since July, and now she wants me to travel to Kiev in November to meet her. She is travelling about 100km to meet me and intends to stay for a few days. Obviously there is no question or promises of any intimate contact, but just an introduction and some time together. There is no mention of any money or accommodation help.
Please could anyone advise if this is just too good to be true, or am I being too naive here?
By the way, I am 45 and she is 44.
Any advice is appreciated.
Olga, a good plan??? Maybe when time gets closer there will certainly be mention of paying for some costs.
Interesting to find out her feelings on apt, does she have a preference. Find out what she has in mind.
On the outside looks promising but when it comes closer your vision will be clearer.
Be prepared to pay for apt, her taxi(roundtrip), all food and entertainment.... this is reasonable thou if you and
her are ready for meeting.
Thanks for the advice. In answer to Olga, no we have not spoken on the phone yet, nor has any accommodation details been discussed.
If money is mentioned, then I'll be wary, but naturally I want to take her to as many venues and exhibitions as possible, and I certainly won't expect her to pay for anything.
I dunno beems - if a woman in the FSU at 44 finds a man her same age and is interested in her? He is more than gold to her - he is a chance at her future. There are many things she might have done to travel - like go on vacation, to find a job, etc.
I'd be impressed... I think its a good plan too, but he needs to get a feel for her sincerity through some phone calls before he meets...
It all comes down what you have to offer girl. Some guys have not much to offer and realize this and in turn
do not expect much while others have much to offer and in turn expect a bit more...to each his own. I am not about to tell anybody what is right or not right for them.
Maybe it is the first and possibly only opportunity for her to meet "any" westerner. Just take a look at the profiles of women in the 40-45 year age bracket. Not a lot of letters written, so I don't find it difficult to imagine it is extremely rare for a man to even visit one.
Nothing out of the ordinary. A man who can afford to visit and has a stable job and is wanting to find his significant other? He is gold in that fact alone to many women who are simply lonely... sometimes we forget that there are sincere women out there...
Swales I dont think you have any reason for concerns. If your comunication is going well I am sure she will turn up and all will be well. It is right that when you are together it is polite to pay for meals etc, but I am not of the opinion it is necessary to offer a free lunch in everything. If your woman has asked you to meet in Kiev I would not necessarily offer the reimburse her expenses. If we travel to the other side of the world to meet a woman, it is not totally unreasonable that they pay their own busfare or whatever. I offered to pay for my girl to fly from Volg to Moscow and in hindsight I think it was a big mistake to do so. It kinda sets a bad precedent.
Its entirely possible that the money question will NEVER come up. Don't assume that you are on the definitely on the hook to pay for everything. While its true that most Ukrainians are QUITE aware of the fact that westerners tend to have better salaries (and therefore should feel an inherent obligation to pay) there is also a pride factor. Many Ukrainians make decent money and would consider it insulting if a western man thought that they couldn't pay for a simple trip in their own country.
When I flew to Kiev recently, my girlfriend from Mariupol took it upon herself to come and meet me. She rode by train, an ungodly 14 hours, in a smelly, cramped, "cattle car" (3rd class typical Ukrainian). Through total oversight, I never offered to pay for her trip or to reimburse her. I just never thought of it. And she never asked.
Only later when we rode by train (1st class to Simperol) and I walked through a few of those cars in the heat of the afternoon - did I think to ask her if that was similar to the mode of transport that she had used to get to Kiev and what the cost would be. She said it was.
My point is that we assume that we are on the hook to pay for everything - and if we offer most FSU women certainly don't mind. But don't assume that it always has to be that way. In response to the question posed in this thread - its entirely possible that she will never ask or require you to pay a dime.
I met with a girl in Kiev a couple months ago and she lived on outskirts of Kiev, probably around $30 for taxi.
When I was called about meeting, she assumed I would take care of cost of taxi...only way she would meet with guys.
I could have told her no but it was my decision to pay for her taxi....I was brought up to take care of a women if I am able to. To let you guys know, I would do same thing here in LA, although there is a better chance of girl paying for her own dinner at home......something about not not having guy expect something for paying for dinner.
Again, probably a difference in two cultures coming together.
Jet, how did you feel about your girl putting up with 14 hrs of hell, I think very highly of her but for you, I wonder how you felt? It wasn't so much the cost, since it was practically nothing for train ride but riding in a hell hole??? I have heard many stories over past year about riding in trains, especially in 3rd class. I hope you two had a wonderful time...sounds like you got to travel around a bit! Did you make to the seacoast towns?
Unfortunately, I haven't met very many Ukrainians that have that pride factor.
beemer: Had I known that she would put up with 14 hours of hell ahead of time I never would have allowed her to do it. She only told me that she was coming by train. I imagined a cofortable traditional train car as you see in old movies. In Wisconsin we haven't had ANY KIND of passenger train service for so long that I have never ridden on a train.
As a matter of fact, when she returned from Simperol to Mariupol, I offered to pay for her plane ticket. Her mother nixed the idea however because she had a bad dream, that the plane would crash. I refused to let her travel by any means other than AT LEAST 2nd class by train (now knowing what trains were like) but there were no convenient train tickets to be had in any class. We finally opted for bus - even though there had been a nasty multiple fatal accident in the area a few weeks earlier (her mother was not too fond of that idea either).
I flew to Kiev (where she met me). We spent several days in Kiev in a nice apartment before taking a plane to Mariupol (first time she had ever flown). After several days in Mariupol we went by bus to Donetsk. We then boarded a train (1st class - private berth) to Simperol where I arranged to have a taxi waiting to take us to Yalta.
Checked into a hotel in Yalta and spent eleven wonderful days there.
After doing all that I mention in the post above, we were going to part company in Yalta and have her take the bus to Mariupol, while I took a taxi to SImperol and then a plane to Kiev. But she didn't want to say good-bye that soon - so we figured out a way that we could tkae the taxi to Simperol together and she could meet up with her bus, so we could share a few more hours together.
She is an incredible woman and things are going very nicely between us.
The moment I spoke to her at the Romance Social I knew that I had found the one I was looking for. I went to the table and asked if anyone spoke English. She said that she did, so I slid on over and sat next to her. She began doing some basic translation for, but the way that she looked, laughed, talked, smiled, I isntantly knew I had found someone special. And I told those at the table "Okay, I've found who I am looking for."
It sounds like you have quite a girl there. I can understand the mother's concerns. Guess the air travel there is NOT the optimum way of getting around or what they are used to. When I get to Kiev and decide where to go it will DEFINATELY be on a plane.
You mean all this time on this forum, you didn't read the horror stories about train travel??? I do think many Ukrainian's are used to the type of travel in 2nd and 3rd class. If your girl can put up with that 14 hour train
ride, she will definately be able to put up with you!!! :))) Must have been a LONG bus ride back to Mariupol.
I still can't figure what airline travel in Ukraine, most flights have to go through Kiev. I wonder if there is any flights just in southern Ukraine cities.
beemer: Donetsk, Mariupol and Simperol (to name those I am familiar with) all have airports. You can Google on them and find the airlines and schedules. The plane I flew from Simperol to Kiev was a YAK42 (I think). It had a single tube sort of thing in the ceiling that ran the lenghth of tha passenger compartment - spewing cold water mist that was SUPPOSED to be airconditioning. It just sprayed out like a sprinkler system. Water (condensation?) mist also sprayed out of the air nozzle above the passenger seats. Just before takeoff- they cut the "airconditioning" altogether and you are left sitting in a very moist sauna.
I have flown domestic Ukrainian flights twice now - and each time a successful landing occurs - all the passengers clap their hands.
If you've seen some of the old Soviet era planes still in use on these airlines - you wouldn't wonder why they clap for a safe landing.
Yes, they do have airports but you can't go to each one of those from each other. Mostly have to go up to Kiev to come back down. I have had to do this before on Aerosvit. It would have been nice to just go from Odessa to Simferopol. I don't know of any other airlines, maybe unkrainian intl. I see now why your mother-in-law(:)) wouldn't allow her daughter to fly with you!!!!!! I think they just stumbled onto that exotic air conditioning
be just springing a few leaks. Sounds like a Donbass plane. It is what I flew back to Kiev from Simferopol, although my flight was with aerosvit...some kind of agreement.
It is funny you bring up clapping. First flight from LA to Moscow, as soon as plane hit down on land everybody clapped, I was ????????. Same on way back to LA, of course plane was loaded with Russian people. It took all 12 hours for them to fill out immigration forms. Those who spoke English and Russian were at a premium. How unlucky was I, well if I knew Russian I could have spent a lot of time with a beautiful young Russian girl sitting next to me. I even let her dad sit down, he stood up most of flight. I even conversed with him about his daughter amongst other things. They had hoped to find someone to show them around and if I knew Russian it would have been perfect. Ahhhh, that beautiful smile....only very little English. You get the feeling sometimes...maybe it was not meant to be.
Jet, I'll be in GB for Nov 18 game. I'll send you e-mail with specifics.
It sounds like you have a good woman there Jet. If a woman is willing to travel 3rd class to see you, it is rather nice and I would be prepares to up grade her. I was told trains are the way to go but I cant say I think much them. I went 1st class overnight from Moscow to St Pete and it was ok, but cost the same as flying, so whats the point? The sauna on the plane sounds flash,havent seen that before.)
I do like a woman to show some commitment to the relationship. It really became unstuck when I offered to fly mine from Moscow to Thailand. I asked her to see what tickets she could find and came back with the internal flight from Volg to Moscow included. It was not what I offered and the thing is she is not rich, but she can well afford to pay for the short internal flight. I see it as a small token contribution, but she thought it more convenient if I paid for it all. So I cancelled the trip. I was sure that would be the end of the relationship but it seems to have risen from the dead. I think it is best to sort these things out early. They will only cause more trouble later. There is this popular notion that the men pay for everything in Russia. This is not true. Many of the men are unemployed and kept while the women work.
I have no problem with women paying for things. My last holiday in NZ, my girlfriend paid for the hotel.
beemer: All the airports I mention have their flight schedules and the airlines listed on the internet. Just Google the city and "airport". Then contact a Ukrainian travel agent to book the flight that interests you.
The enire reason we took a train from Dontesk to Simperol was the romance of traveling in a private sleeper car. Cost was the same as flying too though.
Sleeper car wasn't really all that private - though it was LOCKED the windowfell open with a resounding thud at one point - and the car matron was in our LOCKED QUARTERS within a half a second to inquire about the noise.
I got a visit offer from my Krivoy Rog girl, welcome any time as her guest and she will put me in her cosy apartment in central Krivoy Rog where I can walk to McDonalds, with her in K.R..is it real or if I go, I will get to K.R, get bashed by her men friends, robbed and dumped in an alley in the slums of Krivoy Rog OR she is genuine and will roll out the red carpet for me at her apartment and I will have a good time..how do I know?
This is lifes big question..I really do not want to be sucked in by her and get bashed and robbed and left for dead in the slums?