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	Create New Topic   My Posts   My forum buddies   Invite friends   Private messages Russian brides > Main Forum > FSU Last Names Author Post ragingbull Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 3/25/2010 2:45:07 PM   How are last names formed in the FSU? It was explained to me a couple of times, but with the language problems I still don't fully understand it. I know it is different.r durak Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 3/26/2010 2:20:42 AM   It would help to have a more specific question. Do you mean, where family names come from? Or how the name changes between male and female members of the family? baron555 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 3/26/2010 8:49:26 AM   Females add an a to the male surname. ragingbull Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 3/26/2010 1:59:10 PM   I meant family names. But how other names are formed will be good to know. franklcsw Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 3/28/2010 11:03:57 AM   1st of all Ragenbull, the FSU was in 1991, almost 2 decades age; and 2nd of all, which country are you referencing to. In Russia, the woman takes her father's first name as her middle name and her last name is her father's last name but ends with "ova" and the man's last name is the same only ends with "ivch or "vch"." Other countries, I don't know. ragingbull Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 3/28/2010 11:11:37 PM   I know a lady from Ukraine. Her father's name, she says, is Vladimir. Her last name is Vladimirovna. From your post, Vladimir is actually her father's middle name? OK. You said Russia. I don't know what you mean about FSU. The F stands for former, right? The Soviet Union will be former forever unless it re-unifies. There is a lady from work from Bulgaria. (She speaks a slightly different form of Russian.) She says names are formed in Bulgaria as it is formed in Russia. I didn't take notes, but she told me how the names are formed. durak Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 3/29/2010 12:34:30 AM   rb, now that I saw your example, I understand what you are asking about. By tradition, unless you know someone very well, you address them (when speaking to the person) by their given name, and a second name. The second name can be either the family name (surname), or patronymic (a variant on their father's name). By example, here is how one might address the first daughter of today's most famous Russian, prime minister Vladimir Putin. His first daughter is named Maria, so a person speaking to her could politely address her as Maria Vladimirovna (Maria, daughter of Vladimir), or as Maria Putina. But if she were giving her full name, she would probably say her given name, then her patronymic, and last her family name: Maria Vladimirovna Putina. In the example you gave, Vladimir IS the name of the Ukrainian lady's father (this works the same in Ukraine as in Russia). It is one of her 'second names', but it is not her family name. It is actually HER middle name; if she wrote out her name in full, it might be (say) Anna Vladimirovna Belikova. So perhaps she hasn't told you her family name (her real last name). Depending on the spelling of her father's name, a woman's patronymic ends either in -ovna or -yevna. Her surname (family name) will have an -a added at the end. Of course, people who know her well won't use a second name -- they will simply call her Maria, or much more likely Masha, the familiar form of her name. If Putin had a son Sergei, the polite forms of address would be Sergei Vladimirovich, or Sergei Putin. As -ovna/-yevna means "daughter of," -ovich/evich means "son of." In America, children are usually taught that to be respectful to adults they don't know well, the must address them by their last name, as in Miss Harris. But in Russia, children call their schoolteachers by first name -- but this is polite, because they also use the second name, for example Elena Ivanova. Another thing that can confuse: as is common in Eastern Europe and Asia, when names are written formally (addresses, documents, lists), the family name is usually written first, followed by the given name. So a letter to Putin's daughter would say Putina Maria on the envelope (if anyone is enough of a gambler to use the Russian postal system). ragingbull Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 3/31/2010 3:44:35 PM   Funny thing, Mr. Durak. In your example, Anna Vladimirovna Belikova are three of the names of women that I corresponded with or visited. Anna, I corresponded for 2-3 months, but did not visit. Vladimirovna is one of the names a woman I visited is using. Vladimir is her father's name. For some reason, she is not using her father's family name. I have to e-mail her to ask why. Another woman I visited is using Belik as her family name. For some reason, she did not add the "ova" at the end. ragingbull Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 5/23/2010 2:54:09 AM   Let's look at Maria Vladimirovna Putina. If she gets married to Igor Chuprina. What would be her name then? If she gets divorced does that change her name again? These names are just made up, but here is what confused me. Assuming that's her real name, I know a lady who now goes by the name Chuprina Maria Vladimirovna. I know her as Maria. Her father's name is Vladimir. She no longer uses Putina, which is normal. The confusion is her former husband's name is now in the beginning, not the end of her name. Mr. Durak? durak Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 5/23/2010 11:33:54 AM   I think there are 2 things going on at once here. 1. It is very common for married FSU women not to take their husband's name. So if a woman is (or has been) married, it is really impossible to guess whether she is using her birth-name or her husband's name. 2. All the way from Hungary to China, there are many cultures in which the standard (or formal) way to write (and sometimes say) a person's full name, is to put the family name before the given name. In the Russian speaking world, this is done frequently, but not very consistently -- so the family name can come either at the start, or at the end! ragingbull Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 5/23/2010 8:37:46 PM   In this particular case, I thought Chuprina was a first name or a given name. She only wanted to be called by her middle name, as some people I know. As it turned out, she only has one given name, Maria. The other names link her to her husband or father. It does get confusing since her child puts Chuprina at the end of her name. Thanks, Mr. Durak. 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