Concerning honesty… I’ve seen how it functions from 2 sides: both from women and men. I was present on many meetings and I had an opportunity to hear women saying “Oh! My boyfriend is calling… Emm.. Tell HIM that it’s my mom.” After several minutes I heard a man saying “Oh! That’s a girl, with whom I am going to meet in the evening. Please tell HER that I am talking to the owner of my apartment or to my friend or whatever”. Everything connected with marriage agencies is BUSINESS! In the center of all such websites there is only an idea of getting money.
WHY do you still continue to register on these websites and believe 20-year old girls, who write you every day that they are dreaming about getting married and having kids with you??? Of course, this is a nice illusion and there are so many people, who feel comfortable living with their illusions. But do you really need this?
Try not to SEARCH for a woman in the marriage agencies, try to FIND her accidentally. You can come to Ukraine or Russia without spending thousands of dollars for letters etc. Think about your interests, think what type of a girl would be the most interesting to communicate with (you should mind that even if you found a nice-looking girl and she agreed to marry you, after making love with her for quiet a long time, you can have a desire to talk to her:) In a real life normal girls don’t spend the whole days on the marriage agency websites! They live. They study, work, they go to the bars (of course all the girls, who are registered on the dating websites don’t drink alcohol and don’t smoke:), communicate with friends, dance, attend exhibitions, travel etc. Take this fact into consideration! What kind of a girl would you like to date? If you are keen on the rock music and you want to find a girl, who will share your likes and if you want to have some fun with her – go to a rock-pub. If you want to find some smart girl, with whom you can talk on many topics – come to the university as a volunteer (offer there an English speaking club). If you are interested in art – visit exhibitions and try to find a girl, you like, there. If you like an active life and you want to find a girl, who is eager to travel with you and not “to serve you a dinner”, find a sport club or some sport event and take part in it. Make an effort in your search! Of course it’s easy to come to girls, who “invite you”. What is the most common result of such meetings? Giving a lot of money, visiting all the possible restaurants and buying some stuff in the shops. I don’t think, it’s what you are searching for. Make a research before coming here. Define your goal. See if there are some events/clubs/exhibitions you would be interested in. There you can find YOUR kind of girl. Register in VK. There you can do the same. There are a lot of groups and events, you can subscribe for. Look through the list of people, who has already subscribed. Find someone, whom you like and write a message “You also like…? Have you ever tried/been/seen? I am going to come to your city. What would you recommend me to see?”
If this first phase was successful, plan the next one. Organize a date. Not just a “romantic dinner”, during which you will be talking about your desire to sleep with a girl! Make it exciting, maybe even extreme. Make her act as in real life and not as “during a meeting with an allien”:) Do something, she doesn’t expect from you. Make her laugh, get surprised and so on.
Do you know, what I have mostly seen during the “dates”? A man, who has a list of names of the girls, he plans to meet with… He comes to a girl, sometimes he says the name of another girl (with whom he met yesterday). He and his “today’s girlfriend ” go to a restaurant (mostly it’s some pompous restaurant, a girl would never afford to go to in a normal life). They eat, go shopping and say “goodbye” forever… Try to offer your variant of a date. Talk to locals and ask about interesting places.
Be honest, make every effort and go of the beaten track!
Disillusion,,, sounds like good advice. I know some of the dates I’ve been on, feel like more of a business meeting than a date. I’ve had a interpreter on most of them,, so it’s not very personal. What I planned to do for my last trip, was to suggest that we,,,,, Do Something???!! But,,, the girl stood me up, and the interp gave a really lame excuse. What the girl didn’t know, was that I planned to bring her here to the US last summer,,, and some place tropic this winter. Her loss!
It doesn’t pay to make any plans with an agency girl.
What you are saying is simply not practical for the great majority of us. In fact, it is even difficult to do in your own town in this day and age, that is why there are loads of dating agencies for local people only.
About finding compatibility, that is the whole point of people's profiles in the dating sites and then exchanging correspondence before going to meet the lady in her town.
Meeting in person is mostly for the lady to be able to smell your chemicals and decide if you are biologically compatible - so don't go to the dates reeking of after shave :-)
Lonelyranger, you are right, it was a girl's loss. But it's good that you understood, it was only business. It would be worse, if you brought her to the US and then saw, she was not serious about your relations.
What I am talking about, is making surprises, bringing a girl into an unusual situation, where you can see her being REAL.
There is nothing unusual and unpredictable in going to a restaurant. It’s easy to get prepared to such event, to think, what you will be talking about, what traits of character you will underline and show.
If the situation is unpredictable/extreme, then a person forgets what he/she was planning to talk about. A person is real.
So you can really understand whether a girl has serious intentions or it’s just a business during the first or second date.
A restaurant period can last months or even years. And despite losing so much time, you want see a REAL her.
I am starting to think that it will cost less in heartache, time and money to hire a local detective to investigate a lady before going to see her. The only problem is finding an honest and competent detective!
I wonder if anybody has hired a detective to investigate a girl. Please tell me.
Wifeseeker, you are talking about agencies as about the only opportunity to get acquainted. Ok. But whom do you find there?
What women are mostly registered in the dating agencies?
A half of women – young ladies, who either consider it to be a business and a way of getting or “earning” money, or girls, who live in the world of fairy tales, where they dream about getting married, becoming a princess and doing nothing.
Another group of women – those, who have already been married, who have kids. Most of them really want to get married. The problem is that they are not so decisive, the question of morality is quiet important for many of them, so they think a lot before agreeing to meet with you. One more problem is that young girls, sending you hundreds of letters, catch your attention, so that you don’t notice the older ones.
Young girls can find good men in Ukraine. Sorry, but it’s a stereotype that all men in Ukraine drink vodka all day long and do nothing. As in all countries, there are good and bad people. I am a young Ukrainian woman. For me it’s not important, whether a man is Ukrainian or a foreigner, the main is to have common interests, to have common topics to discuss together, to be able to FEEL and enjoy each other. There are big cultural and spiritual differences between Ukrainians and people from other countries. Don’t forget that there was an iron curtain for a long time and even after it, you wouldn’t see a lot of people from other countries for example in Nikolaev. I hadn’t met any foreigner until the age of 17, when I started studying at the university.
If you really want to find a girl here, you should make an effort to understand Ukrainian culture and character of Ukrainian women. You can’t come here with your idea of ideal relationship. If you want to become an “international couple”, you should find a balance between her and your views on the relationship.
When you write letters, you can underline your strong points and even not mention some problems you have. The same is done by girls. Even if you are lucky and a girl, you are communicating with, is not a scammer, there is still no guarantee that she is writing you only the truth. When the girls register in the agencies, they are recommended not to write that they smoke or drink any alcohol. On the other side, because of the cultural differences, there can be aspects, which are considered to be not important by a girl, so she won’t mention this and you will be surprised/angry/disappointed, when you see her for the first time in real life.
There is the same problem in the profiles. You mostly find the same information in them. “I dream about creating a family. I like to dance/to listen to music. I like to travel”. I will show you just one of the problems, caused by the cultural peculiarities in such kind of a profile. Earlier I wouldn’t notice it. Look at the sentence “I like to travel”. Most of you think “Cool! I also like to travel. We will travel together. She has already been to other countries etc.” What is in reality? The first variant, why she wrote this is that everybody writes it and it sounds cool. She has already been several times in Crimea near the sea. She liked it and she thinks, she has traveled a lot. The second variant – she would like to travel.
I spent 1 year in another country in order to learn the language. When I just came there, I was constantly repeating that I liked to travel. Then people asked me, what countries I had visited besides my own and after I said that I had been only in Ukraine and it was the first time, when I was abroad, most of them would tell me “So how can you say, you like to travel??”
It’s just a small aspect of cultural differences and information given in letters and profiles. I don’t even want to start analyzing, what people write about their characters and about their plans for future connected with creating a family.
It’s easier to see a REAL person in a REAL life. What can be dating in a real life, I have already written earlier. It’s my opinion. But if I ask my friends (other Ukrainian girls), they would say the same.
I’ve known that the meetings for the girls are only business for a long time now,,, but I meant the dates aren’t very personal or romantic because of the interpreter sitting with us.
It’s been my mission to make the right decisions when choosing the right woman, and not to bring over the wrong one.
I know what you mean about having “real life situations” when dating the girls,, to get them off of the script!
Yes, young an attractive girls can find eligible men in the Ukraine, who do not drink in excess or beat them up. But how many of those men are going to be faithful when she starts getting on a bit. How many of those men, with a good income, are not going to be tempted to go with a beautiful 20 year old (of which there are many looking for a man to support them) when the wife starts getting a few wrinkles? I think not too many.
You seem to assume I do not know about your culture. Let me tell you that the main reason I am looking for a Russian or Ukrainian wife is precisely because I have been a fan of your culture since I was 17, when my mum bought me Crime & Punishment and I read it cover to cover, then I went on from there. Even then I developed an image in my mind of Dunya being the ideal woman. I have learned about history, music, literature, customs, geography and I can talk to any of these girls about anything relating to their culture, many things that they do not know themselves (do you know about Pavel Tchelitchew?). I have several Russian and Ukrainian friends in Facebook. I know several women from the FSU who are married to UK men here. I have travelled to Russia and the Ukraine several times.
And, most importantly, I know a number of couples and women in Russia an Ukraine. Most of them are cases of the man abandoning his wife and children to go with another girl, yet another girl who is dating married men. Another lady and her child were dumped by her husband, then she found a boyfriend who promised her the earth and then dumped her too, etc.
I do not know if you agree, but an ordinary woman near the age of 30 either way, with one or two children, has minimal chances of finding an eligible and good man to look after them.
I am exchanging correspondence with a gorgeous 32 year old lady with a 12 year old child. She has had no luck finding a good man in her country for 10 years and she has just about decided that I am 'the one' even though we have only been writing to each other for a few weeks.
By the way, a couple of girls have sent me pictures of them with a drink in their hand. I said to them brilliant! I would have somebody to go out for a drink with if I married you! Two others have told me, with all honesty, that their main reason for wanting a foreign husband is to be taken our of their country, BUT, that there is no way that they will marry someone they do not feel they can love and they have turned down a couple of marriage proposals.
No, I like the profiles that say: "I am not going to be treated like a scammer, I will give my skype address, email and phone number as and when I want to, I want to have a job, etc." Not the ones thay say "I want to give you as many children as you want and then live to look after your children and your house"
Travelling from Donetsk to Crimea is travelling in my book.
All the ladies I am writing to want to meet me in person at some point. It is the only way to make the final decision about knowing if we are compatible as I said on a posting above.
Yes for me Internet dating is THE ONLY way unless I am prepraped to meet the Russian or Ukrainian lady of my dreams, by chance, in the supermarket or the bus sometime in the next 10 years and I am not prepared to wait.
I have 2 small children to look after, I run 2 businesses and I spend a lot of time dealing with the legal problems I have with my ex-wife. Looking at dating sites in the few spare hours I have is the only way for me. I will struggle to make the trips to meet those ladies but I will try, just for them.
I only want to marry a Russian or Ukrainian lady, that is my problem, what do you want.
Wifeseeker, I don't think that hiring a detective is a good starting point for successful relationship. It should start with trust. I know, it's difficult to trust people after you have a negative experience and even not the only one. If you really want to find a woman in Russia or Ukraine, it would be better if you learn a bit about culture and traditions of these countries (not the stereotypes, which you usually find in the guide book, like drinking vodka and playing balalayka), you should feel what is going on in the heads of these completely different people. Of course it would be easier to do this, if you learn at least some basic Russian.
If you hire a detective, you will just pay a loooot of money (because you are a foreigner). Then he will want even more money. And as a result it will last forever.
I think you sent your posting before mine was published as I had already explained to you my knowledge of your culture.
That is the problem with the way postings are moderated here. They get held for 1 or 2 days before they are published.
Yes of course I am ready to trust the honest ladies, the problem we Western men have is separating the wheat from the chaff.
I appreciate what you are saying about hiring a detective but take the example of Kiwinorth in the thread 'You guys freak me out'. He says it costs him $3000 per trip to go and see a lady. If he was to spend $1000 on a honest and competent detective and he found out that the girl is not good that is $2000 and lost time at work (important for a self-employed person like me) by not going to see the girl.
I still would like to know if anybody has hired a detective successfully.
actually WS, i did use a guy in langansk to check out someone for a small fee.
i forgot all about that.
i guess he is a private detective, he did have a site from memory, name i cannot remember at the moment, but he worked out of lugansk.
it cost me 50us i think,, he asked for some kind of small donation.
hes well known to the scammer agency game.
i already new the girl was dodgy but wanted to know to what extent back here in NZ.
you know the inquisitive side to us and i like piecing together stuff.
this was from my first trip,, he was amazingly good.
there was places i could not get answers but he could.
the girl was quite the entrepreneur:)
he used to post here about 3 years back.
i dont know if hes still doing such but that man was such a help to many in ukraine.
he was a good guy to chat to, very likable.
Well kiwinorth, you know I am now going to pick your brain to help me find the guy ;-)
Do you still have any messages or anything that can help me tracd him?
Will the moderators here remember him?
i think it was this guy,,, i cannot be a 100% sure but it fits,, alexfriends (dot) com
put it this way, if it is him he could give you info on a honest scale of things where or what people to see in Ukraine for this sort of thing, if he only works in Lugansk area.
the info i got from him i dont think i could have done better from Putons thugs..
i guess it helped someone else got him to do a check of the same girl.
personally i wouldnt trust private detective firms in Russia or Ukraine,,, they are usually ex scum policemen or other govt thugs who aren't worth the stuff picked from honest sockless Slavic toes.
I think you are right Kiwi, he does pop in once in a while. I think he only does checking for you in Lugansk. He 'promotes' mamba site for meeting girls.
I never used an investigator before. I do have a friend in Moldova that will do that there. I once had him deliver flowers to a girl and let me know some details about her like how serious and sincere she seemed.
There are plenty of ways to do your own investigating on the net.
It is advisable to make some obvious checks on the Internet before taking time off work and spending money on a long distance journey to meet someone who may have a dubious history or motives, especially if you are going to meet just one girl. But I would feel uncomfortable with employing an investigator. What if she found out? How would you like a dirt-bag digging deep into your private affairs? I would instantly end all communications if I discovered she did this to me, as it is the ultimate act of suspicion. Coming from Western Europe, it is not a long journey for me to travel to Ukraine or western Russia, but I definitely would have sympathy with anyone from America or Australia/N.Z. who needed to take extra precautions on a preventing a wasted journey, even if they had to resort to paying an honest local to make a few simple enquiries.
I am currently corresponding with four decent young women who I have never even yet Googled, because I trust their good characters and honesty implicitly. I suppose I have always trusted my intuition, although I do always check if they have a profile on VK (vk.com) - where a more detailed impression is usually revealed! (And very occasionally the image search 'tineye', but only if I'm suspicious.) Two have clearly expressed that they want to meet me - a purely joint idea which just occurred naturally without any pressure, which I think I should do in two separate visits to keep things simple, even though they live not too far apart. If I have ever communicated with anyone who I do have doubts about, this is usually apparent quite soon in their messages. And VK has been an absolute blessing in confirming hopes or doubts. As for Facebook, I don't think it is even possible to search for anyone by date of birth, which makes the search impossible, so I never use it - or am I doing something wrong?
beemer18: "There are plenty of ways to do your own investigating on the net."
Can you give some tips? For anyone with doubts, it would be much appreciated.