There are many here with more trips under their belt than I do looking for a wife. There are many people here who are with their wives longer than I have been. And there are many here who have better auto correct on their phones than I do too.
My pm box has been kind of blown up lately. I will try to answer any questions here I can to get it all out. I won't talk about the ways i failed as I'm sure there isn't much interest in that.
Anyway the way I found my wife is I picked an area. The donetsk area. Why? Because there were many women with in an hours drive of there. Millions of people but not kiev. It was a far less traveled area, but still with great access. I would not go there today however. I don't think you would be singled out as an American but random shooting and shelling still occurs. Today I think 8 would go to western ukraine. Why? First of all they really dislike Russians so they appreciate americans more this year.
I would go anywhere more than a couple hours west of kiev to the western edge of ukraine. Might be a good time to think about a ski vacation in bukovel. So I would pick my one hour radius circle to encompass several towns. I Would write a form letter to each of the women in those towns who 8 might be interested. As many as there are....10....50...100. One note... form letters are never acceptable EXCEPT for the first contact. You can't tell they are form letters on the first one. Ask a ton of questions. Make it a long and detailed letter.
One other note. Don't exclude women who are totally out of your league. I Made that error and they're was one woman. .. way too young. Way too beautiful. Way too successful. She was a model who was 20 years younger than me. She retired from modeling at 28 and became a dermatologist. She was easily as beautiful as any woman I ever met. So I didn't write to her. Right now she is sleeping next to me and we are married.
Two things will happen. Some will not write back. Some will write back.
Forget the ones who didn't answer. Of the letters you get they will either be form letters, as identified by not really answering your questions, or real responses.
Forget your form letter women.
Now read the letters and decide which ones of those sound like women showing promise. Remember that everyone is not a shining star on their first letter. So over the next few months narrow it down to 10 to 20 women. After 4 months or so schedule a visit. Organize the women in order of attachment you feel for them.
one lie involved here. I told them I was traveling there on the way back form a work trip so the exact day was a 3 or so day window. I told each woman i would be getting there around 3 days later. So each one could make arrangements for me as far as apartments and such. I would just show up at their town at a pre arranged spot at a time. I Didn't get to test out how this worked as the woman I felt the greatest connection with. The first one, is the one i married. I did wrote to the other women wishing them the best of futures and all the happiness in the world. Many of them wrote back with very kind positive letters.
so that's it in a nut shell. If I missed anything feel free to pm me. 8 Only get here about once a week as a rule.
Yes but.... the thing about visiting a number of women on the next trip and tell them lies just does not sound right. It simply is not fair on the genuin ones.
My approach is:
- Of the women who say in their profiles that they do not want to spend months or even days writing but that they will only talk to you face to face, fine, you do not owe them anything, you can even tell them you are visitng a number of ladies if they ask, why not? They will not commit to even talking to you unless you go there.
- Of the women that will write to you, for a while, and who will accept that you will go to see other women too, fine, so long as they know. Or it could be that you will find out (they may acccept it) that they are talking to other men too, then you are even, so why not meet other women.
- Of the women who show serious interest in you, who write to you, talk by Skype and start to develop a relationship with you over a relatively long period of time, you will be unfair to them if you go to see other women too, especially if you do not tell them.
Wifeseeker, I Jane to agree with tom. Yes it is a lie but let's examine it. " I'm coming following a business trip. Ok, what does is mean? It is after a business trip... perhaps not immediately. I'm not lying about my intentions. 8 Would never tell them I want going to meet other women later, and they will not ask. They don't want to know that. I simply put trappings on my trip that it seems to them in only there for them. If you run their nose in it they will reevaluate your sincerity in a negative direction despite me being absolutely sincere. Don't give them a reason to feel they have to ask and they won't ask, simply because they will stick with their belief even if it is not reasonable or stated to go that far and not have a plan b.
My answer is never lie about your intentions in finding a woman but the details of your trip can be implied and they can satisfy their desire for exclusivity in their own mind.
"talk by Skype and start to develop a relationship with you over a relatively long period of time"
Your error is that it's a relationship. You CAN NOT repeat CAN NOT develop a relationship over the internet. You can only develop a relationship by a real meeting in person over time.
I see so many guys who think they have a relationship or a girlfriend over the internet. Then I ask them, Have you actually met her in person? They say, Well no. It could be 'Boris' they have developed a 'relationship' with.
"you will be unfair to them if you go to see other women too, especially if you do not tell them." Complete stupidity. Then again that's why he's at where he's at.
Well Tom Shea, it is just that it is a contradiction, is it not? On the one hand you purport to be honest about your serious intentions, on the other hand you are concocting a story about a business trip which is dishonest.
Then, by definition, you cannot be honest by telling all the girls that you are honest about your intentions to seek a wife in each girl unless you are a Mormon and you intend to take all of them back as your wives.
I actually did something like that. I made a trip and I met a number of ladies over there for the first time. One of them was absolutely gorgeous and I was having feelings for her. However, she started suspecting that I was seeing other girls and started asking leading question. In the end she got pissed off and dropped me. And you know what? she was right. I was lying about seeing other girls. It hurt me a lot to learn the lesson.
That is why you kid yourself that you have a relationship with a woman, after 20 years of trying, that you know has no intention to come to you. You still think she cannot see through you? How many days in the year do you see her? Call that a close romantic relationship?
You are the first to say that communication should be by Skype, phone, etc. and then you say that you could be having a relationship with a Boris, yeah right.
A friendly relationship by email, phone, Skype, etc is a relationship alright.
First friends, then romantic partners. Have you not heard the expression: "marry your best friend"?
"It could be 'Boris' they have developed a 'relationship' with."
Well I take that part back because if you're Skyping/w video at least you know she is the person you're communicating with. But it's impossible to develop emotions and feelings over Skype even if you think you can.
I know of a case where a man thought he was 'dating' someone online. He sent her half his life savings. The pic turned out to be that of porn star Raven Riley.
Only by meeting in person will you see if the person is real and both of your feelings are real. No other way. And that takes time.
I was met with skepticism when I told them I was working and that was the reason I was in each city I visited. I was in fact working by getting photos video and content for a web site I was developing. I was able to develop a few domains and traveled quite a bit in Ukraine. I even had a few travel with me when I was doing my research. I even took a couple pro daters out just to have content or something to write about.
WifeSeeker - you could be communicating with a Boris. I mean she could be beautiful on the outside but a 'Boris' on the inside.
You never know their true intentions until you meet in person.
I remember I was communicating with a sweet girl. She was so nice on the phone and over email. When we met, we met outside of McDonalds. She asked to go inside for something to drink. I said maybe we should go to a nicer place? She said no, she wanted tea and ice cream at McDonalds. I thought, This is great! So undemanding.
Our second date, A dolphin show and more ice cream in a nicer café.
The third date, she was asking me for a US$200 cash gift on the street. I said no thanks, turned around and walked away.
So you never really know someone till you spend time with them, in person, not on Skype.
lonelyranger for the first 1.5 years I traveled there the site was not up. I spent a while developing the idea and content. After the site was launched most of the women seemed uninterested but the agency owners had quite a bit of interest. Since it is very difficult for Ukrainians to transfer money to Ukraine the internet is not seen as a viable option for most. Pro daters really do not want any type of recognition since dating is a job for them. I remember one named Natalia in Kiev who wanted to be seen at expensive places and have men buy her small gifts normally under 100 dollars. She was very careful about not letting you take her picture or any video. I also met some who were not pro daters and we have since become friends. Unless you have some mega web site like Amazon it seams they think of it as just another profile on vkontakt. Most Ukrainians still do not grasp the power of the internet.
I came across an article in the local newspaper about Donetsk. It included an interview with someone living there. The city is like a police state. You better not express yourself openly (especially if your views are not on the separatist's side) or you will get tortured at the very least.
Bow,,, I was curious to know which audience you might be pandering to? The serious wife hunter that might be turned off by Pro daters,,, or the more common traveler,,, guys that encourage pro daters for a week or two?
"So each one could make arrangements for me as far as apartments and such."
No that's wrong. When you do that you become a magnet for apartment rental agents. Remember my rule "Don't let her arrange anything" That includes apartments, airport transfers, the meeting venue and such like.
When you go to an unknown city, stay in a 4 star hotel in the centre. The hotel will offer you security as well as any services you require. Staying at some apartment in the suburbs just makes you vulnerable. They will often come up with the excuse "I want you to live near me." Don't buy it. These ladies are always travelling to the centre of their city for whatever reason.
Meet her in the lobby of your hotel or a nearby café that you choose. There is no need for an elaborate restaurant on the first day.
Those that are working with a particular restaurant will insist on only meeting you there and of course once you're there will run up the bill into the hundreds and we're not talking local currency.
The first date should consist of simple coffee, tea and cake and informal talk of getting to know each other better.
Save your gifts and I mean any gifts till you are well into the relationship. A cheap gift could turn her off from the offset. That's why I've said better to give no gift than a cheap gift and if you give an expensive gift it could be the last time you see her and you'll be left in the dust.
Go gradually. Try to do activities that don't involve spending money such as walks in the park or by the river. That way you'll be able to see what her intentions truly are. If there's chemistry and she likes you she'll want to see you again but don't make her motivation for seeing you some material benefit otherwise you're just buying her.
As to geographical location I can't say that one area is better than the other. You'll obviously want to stay out of the trouble spots but once again I'll say that not one foreigner has been killed or injured due to the current conflict in Ukraine.