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	Create New Topic   My Posts   My forum buddies   Invite friends   Private messages Russian brides > Main Forum > Don’t Mention “The War” !!!!!! Author Post jetmba. Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 12:26:03 AM   "To be honest Georgia wants this breakaway state back and they have armed and been willing to fight for it.The current president got into power on the back of promising to take these breakaways from Georgia back into the fold. But I wonder do South Ossetia realise that when you invite the wolf in its very hard to get him to leave. Georgia has asked for a cease fire today but were refused by Russia. The fear is Russia may occupy Georgia." I agree with colin. Georgia's president has admitted that he was simply biding his time looking for an opportunity to make his move toward capturing South Ossetian. That he made his move when the world was observing the opening of the Olympics was no mere coincidence. But he bit of more than he could chew and underestimated Russia's willingness to respond. Of course he is asking for a cease fire. Georgia's military has been overwhelmed. Georgia is an ally of the US, but the US is in no position to respond to their pleas right now. Thw US is entrenched in ridiculous and foolish wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and is already spread too thin. There is very little incentive for the US to attack a majorly rearmed former super-power. Whats more the US president is a lame duck with little long term power or ability to commit. His own party would oppose any attempt to intervene right now as it would surely cost them even a possibility of modest success in the next election on any level. Right now all the US and European Union can do is "condemn this action" in words alone. Russia was also just looking for the opportunity and excuse to move into Georgia as occupiers. And the Georgian president GAVE them that excuse. Much as he migh currently regret. jetmba. Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 12:43:18 AM   The SU-25 - a mainstay aircraft of Russia's military, was built in a plant in Georgia. Thousands of planes were priduced there in many different versions, before the fall of the Soviet Union. But all were taken out of Georgia when the Soviet Union fell. Georgia flies a few SU-25 itself - but all of the planes in its arsenal were believed produced by parts left in the factory when Georgia became an independent republic. One of the first things Russia did of course was to attack the former production facility (and spare parts warehouse) of the SU-25. Russia also bombed the factory's runway. nasfan6 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 4:25:15 AM   Sorry Peter, using Tom, I had crashandsplash on my mind at the time. If I was to do a dissertation on this subject it would require a lot of time to lay out the issues between these two countries who have had bad blood between them for a long time. Since the experts have spoken, I am now inclined to retort. Since neither Ukraine or Georgia are in the EU there is absolute no benefit. What is the economic and social benefit the the EU brings? Nato does provide a benefit, but Nato does very little and only exacerbates this issue. Remember Kosovo? Clintons idiocy, but this was to empower the ICC and UN. This is Putins main argument for Ossetia. Under the guise of recognition Putin is looking to disrupt natural resource flows to the west. Idiot Danny, when the west is spoken of, it is not just the USA. Anyway we don't need the oil from these regions, it's socialist tools like you that think we need it and stop us in our own country. I agree with Jet above, Putin is an Autocrat, this is his show, no matter who the president is. Along with, Russia when they occupied these countrys after WWII made damn sure there were a lothe of Russian patriated into these countries to exercise control over these new occupied lands. This is why the Balkans have so much disdain with the former soviet union. Also Russians have disdain for Georgia because that's where "Little Joe" was from. Danny Little Joe, is Josef Stalin. This is just a re-inflammation of incidents that happened in the early 90's. Also Putins claim is the Georgians have helped Chechenian rebels hide in Georgia and have given them arms and finances to escalate problems in that region. So if the shoe is on the other foot, where does Putin have claim on Chenchnya, but Georgia doesn't on Ossetia? At the last G8 summit all Putin did was threaten the west with disrupting the flow of oil. Hell look how they manipulated the flow of natural gas to Ukraine during the Orange revolution since Yanokovich didn't win the election. I remember Larissa complaining about no gas because of the revolution, not because of shortages. Putin wants the empire back now he realizes the economic weapon he has and he will not hesitate to use it or military force to accomplish it. This is nothing more than a land grab under the guise of diplomatic recognition for Ossetia. Ben2006 the United States is not an empire, we do not have countries directly under our control as a sovereign single authority. Batman the only part of analysis that Danny has is the first four letters of the word analysis. Danny we'll see how much the Russians care about their own People. Well since Mr. Solzhenitsyn just recently passed away, you should read "The Gulag Archipelago" Though I am positive without a doubt it would be way over your head. Though the combined intellect of the salon girls should be able to help you. By the way dolt, getting closer to Iran? They have that already it's called the Caspian Sea. Seems you are also topographically illiterate also. There are many reasons for this escalation in fighting. What I love though, it's okay for Russia to leave over 2500 peace keepers in Ossetia, they are not occupiers, but the US is wrong for bringing down a terrorist regime. This has been going on with Russia and Georgia since 1991. Oh, by the way, did anyone read in the NY Times where US Soldiers with the aid of Iraqi forces uncovered yellow cake Uraniam in Iraq. It was on page B7 next to the Bloomingdale bra add. Way too funny. Yep no WMD's there. Though I think Mr. Putin could tell you how they helped move them to Syria. So Peter, you can't really trust any media, especially the US media to bring any truth forward since they are on the socialist agenda. Just follow the historical trail of Putin. He was an Andropov guy, hand picked by Gorbachev. Just do a little research on that and follow the trail. Oh, Danny, Andropov was the head of the KGB and General Secretary of the Soviet Union. Putin is KGB. Russia's humanitarianism is well documented, though many said it was better under Czar Nicholas than under the Bolsheviks. It was a handful of Bolsheviks that hijacked a country, not as mass conversion by the people. Talk to anyone of intelligence in the former Soviet Union, they hate the proletariat, they were an uncultured and uneducated class. Hey Danny you fit right in with them. Maxirat Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 5:38:49 AM   An employee of the plane factory that the Russians have supposedly bombed near Tbilisi , has told that the photo’s shown on Western media of mass damage, had actually happened some 18 months before by fire. A civilian apartment building in Gori that the Russians had supposedly bombed and killed 60 civilians, showed a fire on its roof, this apparently is not a normal outcome of Air strikes. Fire is usually inside lower down. Again no proof. Just one photo of a burning building. Georgian President always talks in English and has Georgian & the UN flag behind him ???? Western media are saying Puitin is playing the Media game – strange, even though he and Medvedev can speak English – never do. Russia TV and Internet sites are all showing much film footage and pictures, updated continually. Interviews with South Ossetian civilians that have managed to escape the conflict, telling the gruelling experiences and backing up all film footage etc. On Western TV channels – have seen one dead person (a man in civ cloths) strange thing was, have seen the same man in two different sites dead in different locations. Apart from a women sitting amongst burnt rubble, nothing else except the idiot himself “Saakashvili” putting on the greatest coward act in film history. But – western TV only showed part of the Oscar winning footage. RTV shows more, an embarrassing act of either Media attention or panic stricken paranoia. Maxirat Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 5:52:22 AM   Reports now coming in that the burning apartment block shown on CNN – supposedly in Gori and bombed by Russia, is actually of ruins in Tskhinvali – South Ossetia that was done by Georgian military earlier !!!! There is going to be a lot of egg on faces, more than Saakashvili and his warped govt too !!!! Russia has just this minute called a stop to their peace keeping exercise !!!! Job done and now the Truths to come out and deserved punishments to the perpetrates !!! Rag'n'Bull Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 11:00:51 AM   Fabricated only a picture! Well I guess a picture is one better than a mere picture frame. colin Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 11:04:29 AM   Yes for me its awful to see innocent people losing their lives, mothers losing sons and daughters, children losing fathers and mothers. It was a show of power by Russia and will no doubt make other ex soviet states think twice. I dont know what Georgia was thinking of obviously they thought that the Eu or US would help them out. Recent Russian survey says 3 out of 4 Russians view the Ukraine as a threat. ben2006 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 12:58:25 PM   "There are many reasons for this escalation in fighting. What I love though, it's okay for Russia to leave over 2500 peace keepers in Ossetia, they are not occupiers, but the US is wrong for bringing down a terrorist regime. This has been going on with Russia and Georgia since 1991." Not only Georgia, also Moldova and they may be called "peace keepers" but they are there as a political tool for russia. As Nas suggests they are occupiers and have been for some time. In moldova the separatest region gets gas from Russia about 1/10th the price as the rest of Moldova, and along with the fact the region contains most of the industry (built and run by russians in soviet times) its no wonder they support russia. Russia has an interest in the region just like the US in Iraq. You can say what you want about Putin, he is a far far more popular leader than Bush. Certianly smarter as well. And after this he will be even more popular. Russia are going to be able to bully its smaller neighbours and the EU and US can't stop it. Like the US they claim to be just protecting their citizens. The US no doubt has encourged Georgia, the US are angry that Russia doesn't take a hard line on Iran. Rag'n'Bull Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 2:47:43 PM   Kermit the Frog is smarter than Bush! Rag'n'Bull Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 4:39:55 PM   Isn't it about time you went out a bought a kennel for the forthcoming puppy that you and your bitch are going to have? jetmba. Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 5:06:41 PM   "CHISINAU, Aug 12 (Reuters) - Leaders of Moldova's separatist Transdniestria region said on Tuesday they would break off all contacts with the ex-Soviet state's central government until it denounced Georgian "aggression" in South Ossetia. Transdniestria's Russian-speaking leaders split from Moldova in 1990 in Soviet times on the grounds that the republic's Romanian-speaking majority would join neighbouring Romania. That never happened -- but the two sides fought a brief war in 1992 and a resolution has yet to be found. Transdniestria's leader met Moldova's president in April for the first time since 2001, but the talks produced few results. "Transdniestria hereby declares a moratorium on contacts (with Moldova) until the Moldovan side issues a decisive, unconditional denunciation of Georgia's aggression," the separatist region's Foreign Ministry said in a statement." GUESS who's pulling the strings HERE! Its my guess that next will come an aggressive move by Transdniestria, which if Moldova takes the bait and moves strongly against, will also be met with Russian force. This sounds to me like a set-up by the REAL country pulling the strings - Russia. ben2006 - better get some sandbags and reinforce the WALLS in your flat! ben2006 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 5:32:13 PM   Jetmba, I think its very unlikely, Moldova is quite pro Russia actually, at least compared to Georgia, dispite its long term desire to be part of the EU. Theres always more ink spilt than blood in Moldova and this just another tiff between the two. It was worse last year when Moldova forced all exports for Transdniestria to be approved by the Moldovain government first, any thing that wasn't approved was not allowed into Ukraine or Moldova. Both don't have much in the way of an army either, and Transdniestria is landlocked between Moldova and Ukraine so help from Russia is fraught with complications. Having said that I have my Swiss Army Cybertool Pocket Knife on hand just in case!! Batman Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 5:39:06 PM   Nas, Great post! But how can you mention intelligence and Danny in the same sentence? Danny, still hoping this thing escalates? BTW, you're still an @$$! Rag'n'Bull Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 7:05:10 PM   Batman, Actually there's a lot to be said for you referring to the village idiot as an '@$$', the name has multiple dollar signs in it and, after all, that's what he's all about, he couldn't latch on, naturally, to a petty lady so he spends his multiple dollars on them and he ends up, allbeit temporarily, with a dog. jetmba. Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 8:11:21 PM   Ben2006: The entire Russian 14th Division is headquartered in Transdniestra - including four motorized units and 1,199 men (as of 2006). It is headed by Russian General Major Boris Sergeyev - and I promise that they are not there just on Holiday. I am fully aware of the geography of the situation and that Transdiestra is landlocked which means that you don't have to worry about a naval blockade - but if you think that Russia could not move in groundforces and motorized forces by air - you better think again. As far as Moldova not having much of a stong military - Beorgia had less only around 30 functional aircraft and not many tanks ect. Pity has never exactly been a deterent for an invading force. A Swiss Army Cybertool has a USB portable drive with 1 or 2 gigs of memory. Best back of as many files as you can and be on the ready. Because that Swiss Army Knife is all the help from a foreign military that you are ever likely to see! Rag'n'Bull Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 8:18:50 PM   jet, But how many of the Moldovian aircraft etc. are in 'battle' condition. If it's anything like Ukraine, one only has to travel around the country, past military airfields, to see parked-up 'attack' aircraft that haven't flown in years and probably have birds nesting in them. nasfan6 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/12/2008 10:44:29 PM   This was specifically a warning for Ukraine, which is the prize jewel in this chess game. Danny hell Australia has been beyond the moon, you are like a space station orbiting Uranus all the time. I'm going to call the cracktopracter to help pull your head out of your ass. Don't you have a house to build or a woman to buy. The problem is the Russia wants those republics back. They gave them up out of necessity, not because they wanted to or any great rush of democratic feelings. Now on a a little more stable financial ground the play is going to be made. Putin is no fool, but still a dictator none the less. The problem lies within the EU who for the most part will wring their hands. I was a bit disappointed with Sarcosi trying to broker a peace deal, when sanctions should be taken out agains Russia. The UN will meeting the matter to death and nothing will be done since it's laden with socialist and communist dictators. The US should immediately move the 6th fleet into the Black Sea. We don't need ground troops for this operation. Let's see if Putin blinks. At least thats the move I would propose. Russia's goals are very clear 1.Expulsion of Georgian troops and termination of Georgian sovereignty in South Ossetia and Abkhazia; 2."Regime change" by bringing down President Mikheil Saakashvili and installing a more pro-Russian leadership in Tbilisi; 3.Preventing Georgia from joining NATO and sending a strong message to Ukraine that its insistence on NATO membership may lead to war and/or its dismemberment; 4.Shifting control of the Caucasus, and especially over strategic energy pipelines, by controlling Georgia; and Recreating a 19th-century-style sphere of influence in the former Soviet Union, by the use of force if necessary. Let's see if the rest of the world has the testicular fortitude to challenge Putin. Remember Vlad you can't sell what someone won't buy. This is even a larger reason the US should drill and explore immediately. Putin has played this game with Satellites, now if no one stops him Western Europe will be the next to be blackmailed. Ah the good old days are back again!! ben2006 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/13/2008 2:14:56 AM   Jet, I know all about the Russian 14th Division is headquarter in Transdniestra. Actually why do assume I'm against Russia? my wife is from Transdniestra. I'd be worried if Transdniestra started building a new airport or extending the exisiting run away, but its not happening, since your so smart how about you predict when this will happen. I say this as then I can come back and say you were wrong. If it did happen, at least property prices would drop, hell I could buy a whole damaged appartment block and do it up. Sell it later to wealthly russians. I'm friends with a guy in Moldova, ex KGB, ex Spy, who is a consultant to Moldova Government, he lives down the road. I'll talk to him when I'm town next week. If he leaves the country I'll get out the sandbags and back up my files. But I'm not expecting its going to happen, like I said Moldova is on much better terms with Moscow than Georgia, the current governement in fact is the Party of Communists of the Republic of Moldova. jetmba. Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/13/2008 3:18:43 AM   "Actually why do assume I'm against Russia? my wife is from Transdniestra. " Do you suppose that all of the Georgians killed (civilians sitting in their apartments in the capital city ect.) were neccessarily antiRussian? When tank fire came through their windows, or they walked down the street and were hit by shrapnell - do you suppose that their poitical sympathies were measured before theor lives were snuffed out? I'm guessing that MANY poor Georgians have political sympathy toward Russia - just as many poor Moldovans do. Hell, my exfiance is a great admirer of Putin as is her mother - and she considers herself Russian through and through - even regarding Moldovan as her THIRD language (after Russian and English). The Russians (like the Americans) have "smart bombs", but neither side has bombs smart enough to give political sympathy tests to vitims before they are killed. In war the conquered populations are conquered, without regard to the politics of the individual. The fact that you, your wife or my exfiance prefer political ties to Russia, doesn't mean that there are'nt a lot of people who would just as soon join the EU and Nato as quickly as possible. There are people who are even in favor of banning the Russian language and those who understand it but will only answer back in Moldovan (my exfiance HATES those people!). You want a time table as to when any of Moldova will be invaded? Sorry - but I'm not exactly in the inner circle with the Russian higher-ups so I don't know. But the writing is on the wall. Moldova is on great terms with Russia? Is that why all Moldovan wine was BANNED by Russia (along with all Georgian wine) just a few years ago = supposedly for "health reasons", crippling the strongest economic part of Moldova's struggling economy (till then some 80-90%) of all Moldovan wine was exported to Russia. It was well known that the reason for the ban on the wine of BOTH countries (Georgia and Moldova) was the continued insistance thar Russian forces leave the countries involved. Seems that Georgia and Moldova are on the same page in Russia's playbook. ben2006 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 8/13/2008 3:32:18 AM   "Moldova is on great terms with Russia? " Who said that? Not me! Don't twist my words. Your Reply: Your name:   New Registration Password:   Forgot password?   refresh Code:   Russian brides > Main Forum > Don’t Mention “The War” !!!!!!
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