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	Create New Topic   My Posts   My forum buddies   Invite friends   Private messages Russian brides > Main Forum > Damn! Author Post Ditto Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/2/2004 8:45:12 AM   I think you are right Pitchka, but one has to admit that this quest has an element of being artificial or forced. Many of the men here do not have the luxury of spending months together with the ladies in person and so must also rely on the letters and telephone conversations to make a determination about compatability. I am not saying that they should share everything in their first letters, but the ladies should realize that the men do not want to spend months talking about the weather and then decide who to visit. We do not want to waste time corresponding for months only to find out the compatability is not there. It is a waste of the lady's time also. All I am saying is that the process is a time-compressed one and needs to be done as efficiently as possible. Both sides need to realize this. groon Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/3/2004 6:09:54 AM   Ptichka: Umm... no but I do exspect some real content not small talk. I don't know about you but when I meet new freinds I don't BS with them about the weather and other small talk. We find a comon interest and actually have a conversation. I'm a bit more realistic. If there is a chance for more than friendship then it will happen on it's own you can't force that. And yes I am an open book to anyone and everyone I meet. I don't feel the need to hide anything. I am who I am. I am very proude of who I am. Why hide anything? How will anyone know who you are if you feed them BS? You may feel the need to be guarded with people. I don't. What's the worst that could happen? They won't like me? That's a part of life. You will get hurt. It is a risk you take when you talk to people. If you are afraid of getting hurt then I honestly feel you are not ready for much of a relationship. I like to cut through the BS. Everyone I know knows I mean what I say and I say what I mean. You sound like you think communication magically happens without people actually talking to eachother. Being honest and thoughtful with your answers. Small talk is not communication. It is what you do to pass the time. It's saying a lot of nothing. I answer all questions these ladies put to me but hey do not return the favor. So far only one of the many ladies that I have corresponded with has actually made an attempt at real conversation. groon Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/3/2004 6:14:11 AM   Ditto: Exactly. Ptichka Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/3/2004 10:36:00 AM   Groon...I don't know how it is a tradition to communicate there...I can only speak for here and for myself. I know that sometimes it's better to hide your feelings away...the worst thing which can happen here if you're honest and open with everybody...is that you can get used of, or when you will be returning home people with whom you talked may follow you and rob you and it will be your luck if you will be alive and healthy after that. Luckily I never got in that situation and I hope that I never will be in it!!! If we talk about being honest and open with everybody this is my point of view. If we talk about being honest and open with friends I have another point of view...with friends one should be open of course, but there are things and opinionds I will never say to my friends, so not to hurt them!!! Here we value friends a lot, and many people I know prefer to keep silence about some things then to lose friends. If we talk about the relations, then of course there should be total honesty...but again...here before 2 people start being completely honest and talk over many things, including their beliefs, sex and so on, some time should pass, during which people try to see who the person is, is he something he seams to be, or does he pretends??? People here, at least those I know, value love and friendship most of all, and they never try to hurt such feelings. So it's not that easy to say for a person here "What's the worst that could happen? They won't like me? That's a part of life. You will get hurt."...hurted people can do many many things, which may be not good!!! I believe that in every true Ukrainian person hides a great diplomatist!!!:) Ptichka Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/3/2004 10:37:09 AM   "If you are afraid of getting hurt then I honestly feel you are not ready for much of a relationship"...personally I think that if a person tries to avoid to hurt the person he loves, this is the real care about that person!!! Of course if it doesn't include lies:) jjbarrier Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/3/2004 12:53:25 PM   Ptchika - I don't know how life is in Ukraine and how much of a concern your safety is in your daily lives. When you are communicating over the internet it is hard to see how there should be a risk of someone following you home or robbing you - in a sense that is what is great about the internet in that it allows you to be very open and honest and still you can maintain your anonymity. If you choose to give out your contact information, then that's different, but I assume you do that only after your relationship has reached a certain level. I totally agree with Groon, that a good many of the letters I receive are rather superficial, but I see both sides. If ladies wish to send out large quantities of letters in the hope that a meager few actually give them real answers, they are free to do that. All I can say is that I am more likely to respond or keep the correspondence going if I feel that the lady puts a similar amount of effort into it as I do, both in terms of length of the letters, as well as the thoughts she puts into. Just as Groon I take time to answer whatever questions they have, and I take an interest in their lives. Many times my questions were not answered, and the letter I got in return may just as well have been written to Tom, Dick, or Harry. So what am I supposed to conclude from that? And I have received letters from ladies from Azov, that amazingly contained complete passages that were alike, word for word. ANybody who knows about statistics realizes how small the chance of that happening really is. Ptichka Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/3/2004 1:13:02 PM   Jjbarrier I can't say anything about meeting people over e-mail in the Internet and searching for soul mate over Internet, I've never done that, and I hope that my boyfriend and I will stay together always!!!:) So I think that you, Groon and I we can describe things like they are over Internet and how they are here in real life, but comparing them it's a hard thing to do. And I hope that those who will read the words written above will think them over very carefully, and then each of them will think what is better for himself...it an be any opinion...I think that the role of this forum is in giving people information and opinions to think over, and not in giving them complete answers to the questions, as not a single complete answer may be given how to behave in this or tat situation as situations differ a lot...everything what is written in this post is IMHO :) Dale E Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/3/2004 4:59:40 PM   Ptichka- When receiving letters from women, we hope to find that the women express their personalities through their letters and show us what makes them more special than the next girl.Women who only write about superficial topics over and over will eventually lose our interest in them. Their personality must shine through in their letters. I would much rather keep writting to a girl who says, "your photograph makes me vomit", than to one who keeps telling me about the weather, her job, or her daily jog through the park. Alot of womens letters makes them sound like robots. I am looking for some type of uniqueness that makes me think, "I like this woman". You stated above that you believe that in every true Ukrainian person hides a "great diplomat". That is what we are trying find in our letters , "that great diplomat". I certainly don't need to hear their life's story, just would like to see a lttle more expressiveness in the letters so I can understand what kind of person they are. Just as we did not know you very well at first, after time and expressing your own opinions, we got to know and understand you better. I think I can speak for most men here in saying you are our "dear friend Ptichka" IMHO :o) jjbarrier Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/3/2004 9:11:25 PM   I second that motion, and am glad to have a different perspective than the Western Male point of view. Ptchika, of course I agree that no one statement can be right for everyone, and we all have to determine what works and what doesn't for ourselves, but I think Dale, Groon, and I are in agreement that letters that do not make us feel like the lady is really interested in communicating with us will not hold our interest for long. Again, nobody expect to hear all the innermost thoughts of another person in the first few letters, but if she doesn't allow us a glimpse into her personality at all then how are we supposed to believe that she ever will? I am not sure that I agree with Dale on us trying to find the great diplomat, though, because to me diplomacy has an element of hiding one's real thoughts or feelings and disguising them in other words, so I'd rather have someone who is honest, even if it hurts. scottlf Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/3/2004 9:53:49 PM   JJ, I have heard it stated that Diplomacy is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip. For the most part, I am up front about who I am and what I am looking for. If that person does not respond or does not wish to pursue a relationship, it is doubtful it would have worked out the long way, either. Just my approach. jjbarrier Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/3/2004 10:22:14 PM   Exactly how I feel as well. I think I heard the same thing about salesmanship rather than diplomacy, I think both are related in that they have difficulties with the truth. Seriously speaking, you have to be honest, because nothing less than your happiness is at stake here, and I can't really think of a more important thing. That's not meant to be selfish, but there is no point in trying to deceive someone or be less than upfront about what and who you are, and then regret it later. A life time is an awfully long time to feel regret or misery. And it's not fair to the lady either, she will probably give up her life to be with us, so we better make sure that it's really the right match. While for us the risk is both emotional and financial, for the ladies it's still higher I think because they will leave their friends and families behind, their jobs or careers, and when they enter the work force in our country it will probably be at a lower level than what they are used to. Who among the men here would go to live in Russia to be with his woman? idiotdetector Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/4/2004 5:33:15 AM   To all the guys, I agree. I had this girl who was always making small talk but told me nothing. She never answerd my question so I told her that I was unhappy about. She replied that she never told me about her family and her day to day life as I can understand such things when we meet. My reply, yes you are a beautiful woman, but there are manny beautiful woman on the internet. I am corresponding to find one I wish to meet. If I know nothing about you, why should I buy a plane ticket to come and see you, a girl I do not know. What makes you more special than any other girl here. Since she has tried to put a little sunshine in her letters but has failed to truly interest me. We are all here trying to understand these women but I think that they need to do show some understanding to our situation also. It is difficult from both sides. groon Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/7/2004 3:43:10 AM   Yeah. All I ask is to be given a real chance to know the person I am corresponding with. I know if things work out here she will be giving up everything she knows to be with me here. I will not feel right asking anyone to make that kind of sacrifice if I don't know them and feel they truly know what they are getting into. I do not want someone who will later realize they did not fully comprehend what hey gave up and be miserable. We are all looking for a partner. At least I hope we all are. Both sides of this issue need to make well informed choices. idiotdetector: Yes I had a woman want me to go visit after only a hand full of letters. Mine were thoughtful and showed interest in her. Her letters were like the others. Lots of small talk. Fluff no substance. Again ignored most of my questions. They pretty much felt like templates. I told her something similar to what you told that girl. I pointed out how little I know about her. That she was still pretty much a stranger to me. I could not justify the expense both in time and money to fly over there to see her. I haven’t heard from her since. In one of her letters she said how much she like how honest and frank my letters were. I guess she changed her mind…. It just amazes me. I also have to wonder when an 18 or 19 year old girl says she’d like to get to know me. I’m 32 years old. What in the world could we have in common to base anything on? Their letters illustrate this so well. They tend to be only 4 or 5 lines long. Ptichka: I can see what you mean but to me the style of interaction you are talking about is fine for people that live very close to each other. Unfortunately this is not the case here. This situation we all find ourselves in requires people to be more upfront and honest with themselves and the persons they are writing to. One of the questions I will ask a lady that I begin writing to is what about my profile and letters makes you want to continue our correspondence. Just to see if they even paid that must attention. If they hadn’t taken a real good look at it then this gives them a chance to do just that. I have yet to read an answer that is more than just “You are a nice man.” Like someone else said it makes me feel like I’m talking to a robot. You express yourself very well here in the forums and you have my respect. I only wish more of the women who write me would show as much personality. GLTALLTOAD Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/7/2004 12:17:53 PM   ID, you hit the nail in the head..."We are all here trying to understand these women but I think that they need to show some understanding to our situation also." Pitchka "babe"...:)) I know it is not your particular situation or goal, but I think you will agree with me that the 10,000s of other FSU women willing to start serious relationships with a foreign man KNOW that it is them who will have to move to the man's country to start a new life if they want that relationship to succeed. Despite the traditional higher levels of naivete among westerners, few of these men will make such a costly commitment to any foreign woman without the comfort of knowing his FSU woman is willing to communicate honestly, openly and frequently with him. When an FSU woman moves to the west she faces a long and complicated list of challenges to adapt to her new day to day life. The man's challenge is to provide the environment, tolerance, financial stability and encouragement for the transition period to go as smooth as possible. The ability for these two people to communicate without effort is one of the most important ingredients for a successful process of adaptation for the woman. Most men in here know this...that's why when we find someone we like we want her to be open with us in our communications by e-mail, phone or pidgeon messages. toad Dale E Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/7/2004 12:47:20 PM   I think the letter writting works both ways. A woman that gets a fair amount of mail also has her choice on who to continue correspondance with. I'm sure the woman is looking for some letters with some substance to make her decision. Ptichka Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/7/2004 12:59:06 PM   Toad yes I agree that when a woman from FSU starts to search for her soul-mate in the foreign country, she realizes that she will have to move there. But as far as I know, at least among my friends, many fancy their future life like a "fairy-tale" life, and that there will be only lin of happiness and nothing else...it doesn't mean that they feel this way only to getting married with a foreigner they feel the same way about getting married with a local man as well... GLTALLTOAD Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/7/2004 1:25:53 PM   pitchka, tell your friends there is no fairy tale happy marriage waiting for them....only the one the can forge for themselves....:))) Ptichka Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/7/2004 1:38:51 PM   Toad...you see telling my friends something, or making them think another way...I was asked for that many times, the boyfriends and husbands of my friends asked that...and I always denied that, as you never will make the person think another way if he is sure in what he thinks is true... groon Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/7/2004 3:15:46 PM   Well, the unrealistic expectation thing is alive and well among western women. I have dated local women with odd views of how a relationship should be and marriage. I chalk it up to too much MTV and other garbage on TV telling them what to expect. I have a close female friend that had this problem. She married and divorced in the same year. GLTALLTOAD Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 7/7/2004 8:18:46 PM   Groon, The "western woman marriage/relationship expectation" topic has been beaten to death in this forum, lol...let's let it RIP Your Reply: Your name:   New Registration Password:   Forgot password?   refresh Code:   Russian brides > Main Forum > Damn!
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