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	Create New Topic   My Posts   My forum buddies   Invite friends   Private messages Russian brides > Main Forum > Quick Advice Author Post Rag'n'Bull Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/14/2010 12:21:47 PM   Simpleton, Had you mentioned 'Anastasia' earlier in this thread then it would have put something of a different light on it, that combined with her declining to provide contact information, being listed on multiple sites and being 'eye candy'! You did make mistakes, as mentioned previously in this thread, but your biggest mistake was to meet with an Anastasia/multiple site 'eye candy' who had refused to provide her contact info. :) Rick, If you have visited those other eastern European countries then I was not referring to you when I said 'ONLY' Ukraine however I disagree somewhat regarding less time with a lady in Russia. When I was looking round I declined to consider travelling to east of the Russian Urals, due to travelling on clapped out Russian aircraft all that way from Moscow, but one can transit, reasonably quickly, via 2 Mosow airorts and, perhaps, SPb airport to many cities in European Russia. But think about it Rick, if all these men think like you then imagine how many Russian ladies there may be waiting for a western man to visit! Simpleton Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/14/2010 1:37:41 PM   idn't realize the whole thing didn't post. Here is an attempt at the rest. So, going by what I have read here, that is a Very Bad Sign. Additionally, it seemed like a different person writing on Mermaladies compared to Anastasia. The tone was different, and her Romanized name was spelled differently. I found that odd. On Anastasia it had always been the same. There it was different, and 3 kinds of different. One matched the way her letters were signed on Anastasia. Another thing, she said she had graduated in June, and at some point in July she had gotten a job in a bank. That was through Anastasia. Somewhere in our correspondence on Mermaladies, she said she had been working in the bank for approximately 6 months, which would have been back in February-ish. Ok, so things are piling up that don’t make sense, but I already have my tickets. I have a feeling everything is not on the up and up. So, I write to her on Anastasia and tell her I have some concerns and ask some very direct questions. Her response was that if I didn’t trust her intensions then she had reason to not trust mine. So, I sent another letter on Anastasia (I cancelled the account on Mermaladies) going into great detail about the tangible reasons I had concerns. I also mentioned some of the intangibles too. I tried to not be accusing, just trying to clear up any miscommunication. Her response was that we could talk about it all when I arrived and met. She did not address a single issue I brought up except she doesn’t give her personal details due to people she has not met due to security reasons. That was the last correspondence we had prior to me being in Ukraine, and was approximately 3 weeks before I arrived. Not that this is any excuse, but I was awake for 31 hours before my first plane took off. With the layovers and what not, the flight left at 9 AM and I arrived at 4 PM the next day. I did get some sleep on the flights, but not much. I arrived in Y’s home town, and the next morning I sent her a message via Anastasia that I was here. The only information I was given was the address of the agency she goes through, though not the name even though I asked for that. Anyway, sent the message, hopped in the shower, and as I was drying off the room phone rang. It was the front desk and the interpreter was there looking for me (I had said what hotel I was at). I’ll call the interpreter T. T said she had received the message and called Y, and she would meet me that night. She called Y on the spot and we were to meet at 5 PM. It was late morning at the time. I was in complete shock. I had not brought anything from home, and I don’t travel much so I know nearly nothing about the Duty Free shops, so I didn’t know about the perfume sampler packs and what not, though I had walked through a couple during layovers. I took a walk, about 6 miles round trip, and didn’t see a single flower kiosk or whatever it is. So I did think something about it, but as I have stated, my Russian is not good, even with the effort I made. Probably the worst reason of all here is I was very self conscious about being a tourist/foreigner, and my poor Russian. So, I didn’t ask people like I could have. I couldn’t tell one store from the next, and didn’t walk into any of them in hopes of finding something, though that didn’t even really cross my mind. Five o’clock came around, and I had nothing, and being naïve didn’t realize it would make that big of a difference. T meet me at the hotel and we walked to meet Y. During that walk, T seemed very…hesitant about Y. She wouldn’t say too much directly, but about the first thing out of her mouth was “Don’t buy anything for Y unless you really want to.” At one other point T mentioned that Y is “very amibitious,” and when I said that was good, the response was “Well, maybe.” During that time T also told me that Y “changes her mind a lot” and “jumps all over the place”. Also, Y had been in a 2 year relationship with a 40 year old man (she would have been 20 to 22-ish at that time) from Austria and that they were engaged until Y went to Austria to spend time with him, but his family ended up being adamantly against the marriage. He broke it off. Also, I am the 4th or 5th man to visit Y. At this point I asked T about souvenirs for my nieces, 7 and 10. This was the only time *I* brought it up. Just for frame of reference, Y is 24 now. I am 35. Though I consider myself overweight (I definitely don’t have a six pack) I weight train and exercise. Though I don’t rank myself on the looks scale for the most part, I don’t think I’m ugly. I have dated women back home 10 years younger than myself, though not often and the age difference is too big there. I have a good, white-collar job, but nothing that would be considered prestigious. So, we met up with Y and went to “the best place in town” for dinner. It “is a little more expensive” than everywhere else, but the service and quality is worth it. All in all it was an ok date at best; though I don’t know how good it can be when having to go through an interpreter. I paid for everything as expected, and we made plans to go down by the sea at 2 PM the next day. Again, I did think about trying to get her flowers, but. . . The plan was to wake up, get breakfast, and try and find flowers somewhere. At this point I knew where they weren’t at the very least. Problem was I overslept my alarm. I had just enough time to shower and get ready and meet them. They asked me if I had eaten, which I hadn’t, and explained to them that I overslept my alarm. This part of the date went very well. She was playful and engaging, she was trying to speak in English a bit more. I took a couple pictures by the sea, and she wanted to get one with us. We weren’t there very long, and they called a taxi and we went to the s Simpleton Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/14/2010 2:05:36 PM   A few side notes. I was eventually able to find out the agency that the girl goes though, the one the translator works for. This agency is on the black list of both Jim's and Elena's. The translator was great (though a little pricier from what I have gathered, and I paid for her meals when we went out as well). I do feel she was looking out for me, encourage the lady to try and speak English, etc. Obviously some of that is because I am the one paying the tab. I realize that just because one is good doesn't mean the agency is good. I did go out with another girl from that agency who is fluent in English and also on Anastatia (the one the translator recommended right off, before I even met the first woman). We had a great time, she hasn't asked me for anything (though I did get her some flowers when we met) and was concerned that when we went out to eat that it "wasn't too expensive of a place". We went out again tonight too, and just walked around the city. Best time I've had so far even though she said she was in a bad mood today and felt bad about it. I assured her I enjoyed her company, and though there were lapses in the conversation, it was very good overall. She kept saying that when we see each other tomorrow she's sure sure she'll be in a better mood, and doing something together tomorrow was completely her idea. Simpleton Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/14/2010 2:10:45 PM   Oh, and the translator mentioned that they have to photoshop most of the pictures, or Anastasia won't accept them. She said they try to do as little as possible, lighten/darken/etc., but I got the impression that sometimes they do a bit more. She asked me if I had been able to notice the photoshop in any of the pictures. She also related a story about one girl who refused to allow her pictures to be photoshopped. Anastasia would not allow the girl onto their site. The agency spoke with Anastasia about the what and why fors, but the the un-photoshopped pictures were not up to the Anastatia standard and didn't care about the woman's desire to be as true as she could be. devilmaycare Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/14/2010 4:48:32 PM   "the girls I've had time with there, minus some agency girls would never and I mean never begrudge a person for trying to do something with left over food or be pissed because of no gift. this is laughable, come on you lot, dont make excuses for such people or make people believe a gift is vital even for such cheeky cows,," Exactly kwn. Dont have much to add to that. Harvey Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/14/2010 6:33:51 PM   A gift can be as simple as something made out of driftwood for God's sake :) Perhaps I gave the wrong impression. What I meant was that if you have a good connection - even though it is only through email danny - it would be considerate to bring along a little something. This is for someone you have shared almost everything with and got to know reasonably well albeit only through the internet. I guess I am thinking from a chivalrous standpoint. Yeah, I wouldn't take a gift to an arranged meeting. ... ... ... ... As for everything else, you pros have it all covered. And to those who say have a back up plan, did this guy have a backup plan? ??? And to go to the far ends of Russia one would not have the luxury of a backup plan considering the travel to an off the road locale unless you line up a few girls from bumfook Russia, but they probably know each other. For that one must be reasonably sure the person they are going to meet has good intentions. And again, it's still a turkey shoot. "And the band played on...' Rag'n'Bull Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/14/2010 7:30:10 PM   Point made Ralph, I haven't been suggesting a mega gift, Batman mentioned flowers or a trinket, perhaps chocolates or, from correspondence, one can learn her favourite perfume and buy it pretty damn cheap on the internet before travelling. All these guys that talk of checking ladies out by sending them, internet arranged, flowers early in the correspondence but to suggest they actually buy them flowers when they get there ..... one gets flamed for so much as suggesting it! :) As soon as a guy arranges travel, from the US, to a lady he's already invested circa $3000 in to the venture, is it really too much to ask him to invest another $30 or whatever? OK, Simpleton's lady was an Anastasia eye candy but it is not unreasonable that a genuine lady will be looking forward to a man arriving, how much nicer that arrival would be if the man made a small effort to bring a pleasant, ice breaking, smile to the lady's face by gesture of a gift? This is particularly so for all these guys that seem to believe the 'U' in FSU stands for 'Ukraine', these Ukrainian women have become an over commercialised product, for the men it's dog eat dog whilst for the ladies, particularly the pretty ones, they can pick and choose, there are so many men travelling there, and they also like to compare, to boast, with their friends which one got the more expensive gift from the man. Mini Cooper Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/15/2010 2:17:32 AM   I believe small gifts should be given to all these ladies. I traveled to Russia a several times either to meet my Russian girlfriend at the time or to visit with her family after we were married. Everytime someone (Russian acquaintence) came to visit her they brought a gift for her and me to! Without a doubt it is part of their culture to give a gift if someone visits them. When I first met my Ukrainian fiancee (1.5 years ago) I presented her with a single red rose and a box of 10 chocolates. We ate the chocolates together in the taxi from Semerfopol (spelling) to Yalta... she was happy. durak Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/15/2010 2:24:52 AM   Simpleton, I appreciate your candor. Now that I know more, the label "pro dater" sure seems to fit. Deep in my heart, I don't really blame these girls. An endless conveyor belt of naive men with wallets full of dollars, pounds, euros etc. When opportunity knocks, why not answer? If our local sidewalks were sprinkled with money, how many of us wouldn't stoop sometimes to pick up a few banknotes? And who knows ... if she isn't already happily married, maybe one of the men she is exploiting could turn out to be a good catch! If any reader thinks I'm making fun of men who fall into this kind of trap ... those who have read my posts about the Ukrainian fashion model will remember that I've done it myself, at least once ;) For a man who is seeking an adventure or experience, or simply sex tourism, it doesn't much matter whether a woman is this sort of pro. Only those who want to make a strong and lasting marriage need to be very careful. So, Simpleton, for you the news is not at all bad. This encounter doesn't seem to have cost you much, and you have seen up close an apparent specimen of the Ukrainian vampire. This is real plus, in identifying others in the future. Quite naturally, it has stung psychologically, and that's fine! It will help you to learn from the experience, and about yourself. I haven't found the one -- indeed, haven't come close yet -- but I have learned a lot, and gotten some clarity about what is important to me, and what isn't. Maybe I'll live out the rest of my days (however many God will grant) alone. Regardless, I won't regret the adventures and experiences. For the most part, I love my time in the Russian-speaking world. Right now, I'm mad as hell because a work emergency is trapping me at home, when I wanted to be Over There during the past couple of weeks. Over There, I have great times when I'm alone, and great times with companions. I really effing love the Russian-speaking world. It is crazy, f*cked-up, sideways, pear-shaped -- a fermenting hotbed of mass psychosis and brittle, wounded pride, strewn with wonderful, caring, hard-laboring people who live by a strange (to Westerners) code that they hope will help them survive it all. In some way I've never made sense of, I feel at home when I'm there, as I have never felt when at home. I have heard that all students of the US Military Academy are taught that any battle plan becomes obsolete, as soon as contact is made with the enemy. So to any man foolish enough to follow Durak's advice: go without expectation, with open heart, mind, and arms. Know that plans will regularly go astray (Russians understand this deeply, and are not surprised when it happens). Look around you, take in the sights, sounds and smells -- the ugly and beautiful together. If you are in a big city, study the faces on the metro -- especially those riding the other way on the endless escalators. Be mindful of your bodily safety, but walk the streets -- try to visit with a family or two, if you can -- get drunk with a couple of Russian guys. What a fascinating study! FSULover Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/15/2010 6:16:31 AM   Danny, According to you, I BOUGHT my wife, because every time I went to see her I carried with me some kind of gift for her. She never asked for anything, but I always made sure that I had something special for her. What did my gesture result in? I got to "buy" the most wonderful wife I never imagine I could have. I thought that love could not be bought, but now I see that I was wrong :-) I was only following a Russian tradition and it paid off. I got more in return than I ever expected. Harvey Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/15/2010 9:05:44 AM   @ kiwinorth - I agree 100% with you. @ simpleton - I think if you decide to continue to pursue a young lady from this area you are well on your way. You have shared an invaluable experience with us. Hopefully others will learn from your experience. In the future learn to stay away from dating/marriage sites that are laden with these types of women. Ukraine is a great place to get your feet wet so to speak. But as Ivor indicates, Russia (FSU) is a big place that has a lot to offer. There are truly very many women who are honest and hoping to find the right man. The problem is finding her first. Then figuring out how to spend time with her. Then, after you are both sure of one another, getting her over here - immigration etc. One piece of advice: Even though some have been successful with a wide age gap, try to be realistic in that area. good luck Simpleton Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/15/2010 11:42:34 AM   Argh. The first few letters keep getting cut off my post, and there must be a character limit, and it is taking a while for my posts to hit the board. I took a couple pictures by the sea, and she wanted to get one with us. We weren’t there very long, and they called a taxi and we went to the same restaurant as the night before. Y went to go wash her hands when we got there, and T said she was in utter shock about Y. That Y was acting like such a lady and that she didn’t know what was going on. Maybe Y had matured in the last year, maybe she really liked me, or that she realized it could be a serious thing because one of her best friends just moved to Germany to marry a man and was very happy. There was supposed to be some kind of city festival, but it had been cancelled that morning for the next weekend. So, I think they weren’t sure what to do. When walking by the sea, T had mentioned the souvenirs for my nieces to Y and they were discussing where might be a good place. At one point, we were all just kind of sitting there. One of them came up with going to find something for the little girls. We did that, and it took almost no time at all. We went outside and again not much was being said, they were thinking about what to do now. I hadn’t thought about the what to do too much with this being her home town and was under the impression from what research I did that typically when visiting in their home town they pick more of what to do. I had mentioned going dancing at the restaurant, and brought it up again. I figured we could go our own way for a little bit, freshen up, get ready for dancing if that is what we were gonna do, and Y seemed a little reluctant. Then, almost out of the blue is when Y had T ask me if I would take her shopping. T was very reluctant to ask. She did not like it at all, but she did. I said I’d rather not right now, and that is when the flip switched. After that, she was just reluctant about anything. At one point she said she didn’t feel well, so I gave her an out and asked if she wanted to go home and rest. She said no. Then something about being sad because she had been planning on visiting her “brother” (she has no siblings, the closest understanding I could get was that it was a cousin). This trip had come up at some earlier point. We went our own way, T came with me when the taxi dropped me off at the hotel. She was encouraging me very strongly to cancel getting back together later that night. I had mentioned a specific club in town, and Y had said she didn’t want to go there. T thought it was because she thought a lot of Y’s friends went there, but she didn’t know. I don’t know that there is any need to comment on this point. I don’t remember who said it, but I’ve been on first dates at home when I went to a usual hang out of the woman I was with, and whoever said it was right, it is distracting at the very least. Anyway, I didn’t think about this at the time, and I had T call Y and ask why not that particular club. All she said was that she didn’t like it, and that she would think of a place. So, we met up later, and Y was passively hostile as I mentioned before. I asked her if she was feeling better, and she said she was fine. She didn’t understand why I was asking. She didn’t remember saying she didn’t feel good earlier. That is another side point. She didn’t seem to remember a whole lot about our correspondence. There were whole conversations that she didn’t recall. I found that odd too. Anyway, the dinner thing was kinda a family style affair. A bunch of food and everyone just grabbed what they wanted. There was a lot left over. T asked me if I wanted to bring it back to the hotel, I said no because I couldn’t reheat it. At that point I offered it to Y. It wasn’t like I was offering it as a “gift”, just didn’t want to see it go to waste. She lives with her mother, and I thought maybe her mother would enjoy it. Taking a quick step back. I don’t know if taking leftovers home is normal here or not, so I was just going to leave the food there until T asked me if I wanted to bring it back to the hotel. At that point, I thought it may be the same as back home and that it was alright. Obviously I was wrong. Abbreviated here because there was more depth previously, she went off. More English in the next 2 minutes than the previous 6 – 7 hours we had spent together all at once. Was it good English? No, but I got the point and I wouldn’t have needed the tone of voice and body language for it to be clear she was upset. I immediately apologized and explained I didn’t understand why she was so upset. T was trying to explain it in Russian. In the end T just said she would tell me later, but those two kept going back and forth for quite a while. When we got back to the hotel T came with me and she tried to explain, though I still don’t get it. Something about Y’s aunt (who lives in Italy, that point seemed to be important), who I had never heard of up until this point, was absolutely shocked that I hadn’t given her something. I’ll leave it there. Like I said, more details about the ending were posted previously, so no need to repeat them here. Rag'n'Bull Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/15/2010 12:13:50 PM   Buying a lady some bathroom scales cracks me up ..... I can just imagine the complex it will give her, and the subsequent "What's wrong with my weight" ear-bending she will give the man. :) Harvey Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/15/2010 12:39:35 PM   it seems there is quite a delay from when some submit posts and when they appear... -:[ beemer18 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/15/2010 7:16:00 PM   Funny...I was under the impression the longer it takes to post the worse the content was.... beemer18 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/15/2010 7:42:35 PM   without reading any responces other than simpletons description......this girl was not attracted to him from the beginning and things just got progressively worse. Bad idea to take girl shopping unless it was for her or for only window shopping(see her taste in clothes). I would have been upset if someone asked me to take a 'doggy bag' of leftovers, as we call it here. You either take it home yourself or leave it there. Girl was already unhappy and anything would make it worse. Using an interpreter does make things uneasy but a must in the beginning to understand each other from the start AND it makes girl feel comfortable to have someone they know there. You always hope after 2-3 dates you can be alone and use gestures or small talk to communicate but only if you both want to continue (w chemistry). My guess is you are in southern ukraine maybe odessa or crimea. I do know a flower shop/s in odessa. I normally bring small gifts( small necklace or perfume) but only for multiple dates, a rose or small bouquet of roses is imperitive in first meeting. nasfan6 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/16/2010 3:48:18 AM   Bakini?? is that some Greek or Italian meal? A fishing rod, yeah that's the ticket. What a moron. ben2006 Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/16/2010 4:31:12 AM   My two cents for what it matters. If a girls asks for you to take her shopping it’s a bad sign. Either she is a pro dater or worse, you’ve missed up. If she needs something then you should known and offered to buy it or just brought it yourself to begin with. Girls don’t like to ask for something. Sometimes it’s not that she’s wants to go shopping but may just like to know you are thinking of her and that you are actually able and prepared to look after her. In my option its best to do as GeminiDreams and Beemer suggests and buy some perfume etc before hand, never allow her to ask you for something. It’s not going to cost a lot but to not do so is disrespectful, especially if you’re buying gifts for other people. It’s a somewhat different mindset there in that girls marry so that they can be looked after by a man and not solely because they what to share their life with their "best friend". This is a generalization of course. But it’s fair to say most girls aren’t looking to live off a mans leftovers. I've had friends who are what you could say are pro-daters. They are actually normal girls. If you respect them, they won't take advantage of you. Even the most harden pro-dater will be taken back if you show her respect and take care of her (and that doesn't have to be buying her a new fur coat or mobile phone!) and she will even like it if you have the courage to stand up to her and say no and tell her behavior is unacceptable. Then you will get respect. You won't get any respect if you just do as she wants all the time. They will test you to see what sort of power they have over you and if you give in all the time they’ll think you’re stupid. Agreed that this girl wasn't interested. Still I don't know why guys are surprised when this sort of thing happens. It comes with the territory. You could beat yourself up and analyze what went wrong while your over there on holiday or learn from it and have a good time while you’re at it or just move on. FSULover Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/16/2010 7:21:59 AM   Danny, I cannot answer your specific question because nobody knows the future and I don't like giving too much personal information in a public forum, but I will say this: she has told me many times (and she acts that way) that she does not want any money from me, so I can work as a pizza delivery or anything else I want and it will not make a difference for her as long as we are together. And by the way, every time I met an FSU girl (first, second, nth time) I bought her flowers (they are everywhere) because it is what is expected from the man. It's FSU culture. Harvey Member send PM   block PM add to buddies Send: 9/16/2010 7:53:19 AM   "I would never buy a girl flowers I didn't have feelings for." ??? Does sending flowers to her mother and sister for 'women's day' count? I did that so I suppose I am an idiot. Do not criticize someone for giving a lady flowers or a token gift. By presenting flowers to a lady is a sign of respect and a gentlemanly thing to do. It is not trying to buy her, overly impress her or whatever. Geeeeze already! Your Reply: Your name:   New Registration Password:   Forgot password?   refresh Code:   Russian brides > Main Forum > Quick Advice
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