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apal1

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	Send: 6/1/2012 3:38:50 AM

Lonely - That's what I did. I took a few years off from FSU girls after that first meeting, I blew off FSU girls. Posted about her, met the long-time guys in here at that time some years ago. You can probably see them on the older threads. If I were to start this all for the first time? I'd write more than 3 girls and meet them with no expectations. If you feel a connection, ask for their skype or email address. I haven't met a single girl in Ukraine who didn't know what Skype was... But if your using a translator they will try to interfere. So just ask for an email address at a first meeting. That doesn't necessarily mean first date, but could be if there's real interest from both of of you. Sure its a crap-shoot. I cannot guarrantee anyones success or failure in a forum, there's so many variables and I;ve listed a few in other posts to help better the odds. I agree on the not-everyone-accepts-a-foreign marriage. There's a stigma attached to a girl from Ukraine dating a foreign guy. The first one is that she couldn't find someone local. Second is that she is marrying only for money if the man is unattractive. Personality and heart of a man's character just doesn't compute at the social-material society structure I've seen in the big cities. If on the other hand, you are handsome, successful, kind and a gentleman? That is a very rare combination, and being a foreigner makes it more adventurous and exotic to young girls who can only find broke local unromantic guys just wanting sex and a good time until the guy finds someone else to use up.

apal1

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	Send: 6/1/2012 3:51:51 AM

Ben - On 05.24.2012 you posted: "9) If you’re accepted by the family then you’re on the right track. Of course they might just be accepting you as you’re a source of financial stability to the entire family. Personally I would expect to be shagging a girl if we were an item (most guys would). Otherwise I'd be thinking when a guy has a good look at her, he’s getting the same as you are except for free." I agreed with #9 on both counts. I was referring to your own statement on that Personally, I would expect... And no I don't stereotype anyone here. I sometimes refer to guys bashing each other for trying to find an FSU wife because they had bad past experiences, as using the forum like it was a support group for past painful experiences... That's what I was referring to that if a guy buys gifts to a Ukraine girl and expects to go to bed with them? In her mind she knows she is prostituting herself. I've had this conversation with so many girls in Ukraine that its been drilled into my head 100x over. But not one of those many scores of different girls I met in Ukraine ever said romance was dead to them. All of them brighten up at the real prospect of a romantic courtship with beautiful relations. I luckily met someone extremely special that shined above the rest of any girl I ever met in my entire life. Our agreement is that she will stay to finish university and live in Odessa. Her family were mostly sailors and took off for many months of the year. So that is normal to her. Odessa is a port city as you know. Actually, I don't have the intention to bring her stateside permanently. I am a world traveller type. She wants to travel the world with me when she can. I know my case is unique and I won't give advice regarding everyone's relationship. Its a very wide world out here. But I won't let guys spout off how bad it is to even try to meet a girl in an agency in FSU. Damn right its freaking difficult as hell. And everyone has their own angles on how they did it and how some of us succeeded at it in about as many different ways as possible. I do software business and have a partnership in Ukraine. So I travel there. Soon I will be bulding more software, so I will probably stay longer to oversee my own software ideas come to fruition, but no its not building an agency website. ;0 I just don't post my entire life here. ;)

apal1

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	Send: 6/1/2012 4:04:21 AM

Ben - PS> If you really actually do find yourself in a real relationship with a Ukraine girl? And do not give any presents on New Years day to your girl's family? You might one day re-read all that I am saying as to why she and her family dumped you... Some of you really do not understand Ukraine culture yet. If you attempt to succeed at what you and Lonely agree to? Your cultural bias will leave you alone and spiteful as to why you might keep failing at this. If you don't believe me? Than write a few girls and ask them about presents and New Years and proper protocol of real courtship in Ukraine. You guys don't sound cheap, but you don't come off as generous types either. Your culture is not like Ukraine culture and that is why I am trying to tell you guys. But don't listen to a guy who has talked to several hundred pretty girls in Ukraine in person to ask them these things. Instead, listen to the old guys who failed at a meeting, or keep listening to second-hand knowledge of some guy who said some other guy said this... Your choice... Your life...

ben2006

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	Send: 6/1/2012 5:02:50 AM

Apal I'm married actually and live in Moldova and work similar to yourself and I'm not old, I'm mid 30's, so your not unique in your situation, ie I work in the software industry but I travel a lot rather than run a team here (tried that too much work as I was trying to do two jobs and still travel). I know about giving presents believe me too, actually its not different to the west in that regards if you think about it (or once was). Its important to show/demonstrate your thinking of her needs and are able to take care of her.

lonelyranger1701

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	Send: 6/1/2012 7:41:06 PM

Apal ,,, Ben is right, you are stereotyping men here. Anyone who hasn’t found their girl by now must be a loser??? They must be; fat, old, ugly, broke, bald, etc, etc! Has it ever occurred to you, that guys could make multiple trips to the FSUs and only meet up with; liars, scammers, or opportunists???? I have zero doubt about it!! I have had girls who didn’t know my name, if I had brothers and sisters, didn’t know if my parents were still alive, what I did for work??!! I have caught them in lies,, they had been on summer vacations,, with or without men, and never wrote about it, but mentioned it during a meeting. Wrote that I was the first man they had met,, or were about to meet,,, and that turns out to be a lie too. If there are good women in agencies,,, then let them prove it, by leaving the agency ASAP!!! Apal,, I only partially agree with you on their culture and about buying things. I have bought things for them in the past, flowers, chocolates, for first meetings, and only a couple received more gifts. To spend, spend, spend is agency and website propaganda,,,, and I won’t play their games! I have always paid for dinner or supper, for the taxi, bus, or metro! I tell them to take a taxi so less time is wasted. If a guy is going to quibble about paying for dinners or taxis,,,,,, don’t go!!! Now for the flipside,,, if you are buying a lot for her and her family,,, does she/they really love you?? What does she love more,, your looks, your personality , or your wallet???? How are you ever going to be sure??? What would happen to your relationship if your money ran out??? “Some of you really do not understand Ukraine culture yet. If you attempt to succeed at what you and Lonely agree to? Your cultural bias will leave you alone and spiteful as to why you might keep failing at this. “ Apal,,, as you might have read already,,,, Ben is married!!!!! Another wrong assumption on your part! If I have to buy their attention/affection ,,, they can stay where there are, because I want a relationship that will last! “Instead, listen to the old guys who failed at a meeting, or keep listening to second-hand knowledge of some guy who said some other guy said this…” By the time your advice gets to the forum,,, it is also “second hand knowledge”!!!! “Your choice... Your life…” It is?? Well I’m glad to hear that!!! I was starting to wonder if anyone understood that??!! Everybody seems so bothered that I am taking a year off! Are you worried that I might start a trend??? It’s no one else’s business but my own!!!

GaryCanada

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	Send: 6/2/2012 8:57:38 AM

This exchange sounds like a daily dose of Mike & Mike in the morning.....

apal1

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	Send: 6/6/2012 1:14:52 AM

Lonely - I agree with you. I personally have seen and experienced a lot of these scams. It's as bad as it gets. I wouldn't doubt that most all the girls I met on Anastasia were getting kickbacks from agencies to write and chat to men. I can tell you stories... What I was not agreeing with you was that each girl is a scammer and that each agency is owned by a scam artist con man. Although in certain cities (Nikolaev for one, my friend Dima who works with the agencies there tells me that the huge majority of agencies there are indeed scammy). Dream-Marriage.com is one of the worst websites around. It's saturated the entire Nikolaev agency network because it allows the same scams to persist. About the gifts, sure I know its crap shoot there. Its not easy. A real girl will not accept gifts until she approves of pursuing a real relationship. Its the scammy con girls that will ask. But I have had so many "discussions" with my own fiance' regarding this that she has difficulty asking for anything from me unless its a special occassion or a reward for something.

apal1

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	Send: 6/6/2012 1:17:40 AM

I met one really hot blondie from HRB and in her first meeting kept mentioning who much she wanted an iPad. I asked her if she thought that was right of her to bring something like that up at a first meeting. She got hurt.offended.defensive I put her on the spotlight like that. I didn't go buy her one. I dumped her a few days later for being a real bitchy sort of girl... ;0

apal1

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	Send: 6/6/2012 1:21:05 AM

Ben - its okay. I didn't know you were already married. I wanted to try Moldova after my own first "issues" when I first went to Ukraine. I heard girls were more humble, mature and attentive than Ukraine girls. I'm not a real big fan of the huge amount of very greedy and poor girls I met in Ukraine. I had no clue as to the extent of the amount of gold-diggers there, but after the last two years of extensive travel experience in Ukraine... I do now.

lonelyranger1701

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	Send: 6/9/2012 1:05:03 AM

Apal,,, I can’t say; that every girl in the Ukraine is a scammer,,,, because I haven’t met “all” of them! But I can now say; that “every” one that “I” met was/is!!! Periodically,,,, I will look through, “Every” photo in scammer list websites! It is amazing just how many familiar faces are in those websites. . Last week, I found the translator/interpreter from my 2010 trip to Kherson. What was her scam??? She scammed a guy for English lessons,,,,, January of this year! She spoke near perfect English back in 2010! I recognized the girl during our meeting and looked for her profile later that night,,, and I found her! She had wrote to me on several websites, several times on some. In some of her profiles she doesn’t speak English,, in others,, she is fluent! She will have very conservative photos in some,,,, Black leather, whips, chains in others! She even had a few “Goth” profiles. She will do what ever it takes I guess?! One thing that I noticed very early during our meeting or date, is that the girl I came to see, wasn’t familiar with me, not really excited either. I most likely appeared the same way to her, because I’m wondering,,, what’s wrong??? The girl went to the bathroom a couple of times,,, and each time,,,, the interpreter and I had a great conversation! When the girl came back,,,, blah! Very little to talk about! I have had this happen many times,,,, it feels like I should be dating the interpreter instead of the girl I came to see?! Last week, I spent hours looking through photos of scammers,, and after I finished, I came to the decision, that I most likely won’t try again next year! But if I do,,,,, if any girl writes or says the words; apartment, interpreter, agency, English lessons, computer, or shopping, more than once,,, I’m moving on!!!! About websites and cities?? Most websites use the same agencies, so there is so little difference! Nikolaev??? I wrote to a lot of women from that city,,, and won’t do it again. They all lied about their English abilities,,,, most said they spoke English until it was time to talk on the phone,,, or until it was time to meet! Then suddenly,,,, they need an interpreter?!

apal1

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	Send: 6/9/2012 5:01:54 PM

How much was she charging for English lessons? Lowest private tutor I could get with my girl was $5 an hour. That sure beat the hell out of the $20 the agency was trying to charge for it. Wholly crap, whips and corinthian leather and that didn't send out warning signs? ;) Girl going to the bathroom a lot, not ever a good sign. Means talking on the cellphone to some boyfriend, doing drugs, or coming off some sort of bladder infection, or drinking too much. ;0 Hey, dont EVER EVER pass up a date with the translator if you get along! I've had more tell me that they really do wish to date a foreign guy. It's why they originally learned the language. A girl who has been in the agency for more than a year and hasn't learned any foreign language isn't as serious in her intentions as one who can speak well enough to have a decent conversation with. That is a golden rule.

lonelyranger1701

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	Send: 6/10/2012 2:43:56 AM

Apal,, it was the interpreter who was caught for scamming money on English lessons. You would need to ask the man who reported her. It’s her profiles that had leather, whips, and chains, and a few simple innocent photos,,, and a couple of Gothic pics. I didn’t know her, or any of this until after the first meeting. The girl was pretty and easy to talk to, but having profiles with whips and chains, ends it with me. What we do in our bedroom is different, I’ll accommodate her on ,,,,, almost,,,, any fantasy,,, but I won’t date anyone who advertises for it online. The girl in Kherson, who I have referred to in the past as the “shy girl” had a boyfriend at the time. I have even wrote to him on Vk!! Most of what he writes does not translate very well though!!! Lol I tried to invite her as a friend on Vk,,,, and I got a letter from him instead! His profile is filled with pictures of them together,,, she has none of him,,, in fact, he is not even a friend on her profile. She wasn’t suppose to drink, smoke or like bars,,, yet she showed up hung over for the second date. I have photos of her in bars drinking and smoking! Yeah,,, she was most likely on the cell phone while going to the bathroom. The phone(s) rings often on most dates,,,, I guess they don’t understand that WE consider that to be very RUDE!! We are suppose to understand their culture, but they won’t do the same for us?? hmmmm I have a few stories about interpreters, that I will share another time,,, I’m tired as hell right now. I had a truck battery explode on me yesterday,,,, filled the cab with fumes and made me damn sick. I woke up this morning with dark circles under my eyes!!

apal1

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	Send: 6/10/2012 1:29:12 PM

Egads, totally agree, anyone promoting S&M on the internet is really a strange case. (Basket case). I don't much like the Goth look. Every person I ever met doing it had very deep mental issues I don't like it when I'm on a date and my girl picks up the cellphone. And its a lot worse when your paying some translator and her phone rings and she starts yapping away in the middle of a translation. I usually tell them not to do it again and we in the West think its very rude. Most everyone I met started understanding it was rude or already knew it (but still happens). You should go to the ER and get checked out LR... really. If your feeling bad now, you might need help if you did inhale Hydrofluoric acid. Get someone to drive you in. Inhaling a acid is the worst.

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