LR: So far, I have not initiated contact with anybody. So my only contact is with women on fiance.com who contracted me first.
Other than chat, none of the lades writing to me have tried to run a scam. Of course, it has only been a few weeks. Once it is clear I will not chat (much), some seem to go away.
As you say, I would think that almost every lady less then 40 with no children who wrote to me was looking for something other than romance. The possible exceptions are attractiveness challenged.
The beautiful, childless 40 year old who told me to write her when I get my butt over to Kharkov - I'm pretty sure she is legitimate.
The mothers who have written to me range from 25 to 36 and one 50 year old with a grown child. This last is probably legitimate. The young mothers range from OK looking to drop dead manually roll my tongue up gorgeous. This one is not even my favorite. But she is from Simferopol:
https://www.fiance.com/agency.asp?main=page&id=141508
S o far, using Google image search, I have not found any of the most gorgeous girls on anything but Ukrainian dating sites. There seems to be an aggregator site that picks them up.
Like I said in my first post, unlike West African scammers, there girls have almost no come-on. Some are clearly flirting, and many seem to have read Dr. Zhivago. All very interesting.
"https://www.fiance.com/agency.asp?main=page&id=128447
Tell me those legs have not been PhotoShop enhanced."
I really do not see anything unusual about those legs. They are great, that is all. You are worrying too much about the agency manipulating photos. Your worry should be whether the photos have been stolen, whether the girl is genuine, etc.
You need to understand, these girls are beautiful and they want to show it.
"Yevgeniya is pretty average girl. nothing special in the looks department"
That's a good point. We all have differing definitions of gorgeous. In this case, the girl in the pictures, on the video and on video chat all match up.
Are there any stats on "normal" guys less than 50 who are actually willing and able make the trip to Ukraine to pull the trigger on a relationship? By normal I mean decent looking, decent income and decent human being.
Btb,,,, even though this site has a translation program,,, most of the letters still go through an agency. Other than doing everything possible to keep you writing,,,, most scams happen when you arrive in her city.
What you need to figure out is,,, are you going to check them out before you fall in love,,,, or after??
I reported that the English level pop up window was not working (receiving error message) and someone finally fixed it now! Kudos to myself for being vigilant.
LR "most scams happen when you arrive in her city. "
That makes a lot of sense to me. It seems like there are a couple of types of scams involved here. I would classify the first as making me pay a price for being given the opportunity to close the deal with a lady who would be clearly not available to me here in the USA. The second would be the pure money extraction scams.
I see these as two very different things. If I come to her country to convince a beautiful younger woman to become my lover then there is no reason she should not ask me to show her a nice time while I am trying to make the sale. She may not have any intent to become my lover, but is giving me the opportunity to change her mind. So if a girl who spent the evening with me asks for taxi fare home and then takes the subway - I don't care. Maybe this is because of the way corporate travel works here in the US. I get a Per Diem when I am on the road that I can spend or not. So I see a girl making a little on the side while going out with me as an OK part of the deal.
I see the other type of scam as the girl is so focused on extracting money out of me that I am not getting the opportunity to make my sale. This girl might even sleep with me if she thought it would get her want she wanted. I might as well sleep with a hooker.
There are probably all types of variations in between. Not a whole lot different than here in the US. Here in the US, I see the sugar baby types being pretty up front with what they want. In the Ukraine, I guess it is socially unacceptable to want to be a sugar baby - if even for a few years.
I have always had a pretty good sense of self preservation and think I could sort the various types of scam a girl might be running on me. If I am dating a girl more than 15 years younger than me, it take her a lot of effort to convince me everything is as it seems.
Trying to find romance or a wife in the FSU, as a business transaction, is going to lead to failure. Romance is not business despite the fact that it is true that the parties may have an interest other than just love - it is human nature.
Here are two exanples of what girls have told me that make the difference. I normally ask girls why they are looking for a foreign man. Surprisingly, many are candid about it. I am not counting the ones that tell you that Western men are the most romantic, desirable, reliable, etc.
Strictly business:
"I want to be taken to a better country"
Romance with business:
"It is true I would like to live in the West but I will not go with a man I do not love"
Sugar baby and young mistress are a lot more common types in Ukraine than in the West, that is why many want out. They know that, come the age of 35, they will be replaced with a younger model and no-one will want them over there again.
You may rightly assume that many of these girls are former young mistresses
This is an example. I know that if I try to see this girl, it is going to cost me, probably a lot, and it is not going to be long term.
https://www.fiance.com/agency.asp?main=page&id=139081
Hello!! How is your Wednesday??
I am going to my work,but my thoughts are full of something else....
I dream as once we will take one hotel room ,and will drink some wine
with fruits and camdies there...Maybe it can be so joyful and pleasurable
for us,and we will not go to any other place,,,i will go to take shower,and
will get out of cabin turn turned into one big towel....
I hope you will not mind if we take our little feast and brinbg it to bed??
How much champagne do you want drink with me??
I wish it could be today
btb:
"So if a girl who spent the evening with me asks for taxi fare home and then takes the subway - I don't care. Maybe this is because of the way corporate travel works here in the US. I get a Per Diem when I am on the road that I can spend or not. So I see a girl making a little on the side while going out with me as an OK part of the deal."
Do you want to be thought of as the job that girl is working??
btb754 wrote: "Are there any stats on "normal" guys less than 50 who are actually willing and able make the trip to Ukraine to pull the trigger on a relationship? By normal I mean decent looking, decent income and decent human being."
The key is GOING TO UKRAINE! Unless you come to Ukraine, letters, phone calls, video chats are all meaningless.
secondly, you can not get attached to a photo. reality when you meet is what matters. There are many pretty girls
and many really nice girls too who genuinely want a relationship. Its just difficult to find them through an agency and
its going to take more than one or two visits a year to find the right girl and have a relationship that leads to marriage.
It can be done though if you are willing to spend the time and money to do it. The more time I spend the more picky I have become
because I know I do not have to fall for every pretty girl I meet. If I get married to a girl here it will absolutely be the
RIGHT one and not just because I am settling for less or desperate.
Oh dear, this Olga. Her message is what I told you about in relation to the poster 4re. From the beginning she is trying to lure you with sex. Then look at her photo.
Already talking about sharing the hotel room. If you wish, read the 4re story.
Where are the references to you and her? like: since you say you like seafood, I can cook you some.
The naughtiest talk I get from genuine girls is things like "a kiss with our drink will be nice" and this is after talking for a while.
Olga also sent me a recent photo of herself. I can see the "aging process". I guess the photos were taken a while ago.
I have noticed that I when I show interest to the same profile across different sites, I get the same first letter from that profile each time. It is either a proxy responder or a standard introductory message to sent to every man who responds to her profile. So if I write to her over several months and then send an interest to her profile on another site, I seem to be back to square one on the other site, as if she is treating me as a stranger. I do not use a template introduction letter, but I guess there are a lot of lazy people.
"So if a girl who spent the evening with me asks for taxi fare home and then takes the subway - I don't care. Maybe this is because of the way corporate travel works here in the US. I get a Per Diem when I am on the road that I can spend or not. So I see a girl making a little on the side while going out with me as an OK part of the deal."
You're equating dating with some kind of business deal or a job when you get a travel allowance. In other words, you're paying her to be with you.
Integrity is important.
If she lies to you in the little things, she'll lie in the big things.
"The key is GOING TO UKRAINE!" Or to Moldova, etc.
"Are there any stats on "normal" guys less than 50 who are actually willing and able make the trip to Ukraine to pull the trigger on a relationship? By normal I mean decent looking, decent income and decent human being."
I get accolades about how nice a person I am, but after being online since April, I have no invitations.
Rick4girl: Completely agree. No hurry since my divorce is not even final. I'm going to define a new type of tourism: dance tourism. I am taking ballroom dance classes here in the US. Those dollars would go a lot farther in the Ukraine.
Btb,, I checked out your last link,,, she’s quite the looker. Her letter is designed to get guys on the plane ASAP! Most will pack so fast, that they forget to bring their wits with them.
I’m not sure how ballroom dancing will help,,, but Slavic people do dance.
The interpreter and I planned to meet my date at a certain restaurant,,, but when we arrived, it was packed full of people,,, and everyone was dancing. I thought to myself,,, ahhh nooo!!! Besides not wanting to dance,,, the place was too busy to take a date to,,, too loud!
One of the "miss wow" suddenly had her profile removed today from this site after she wrote to me earlier today. I had several contact profiles removed after they sent me some messages. Nothing unusual in the messages, just how are you and mundane comments. Maybe it's my body odor?