It's not forcing any beliefs Ben2006, just regurgitating facts. There are many religions different than mine, all on a similar path. I don't think you've really ever taken time to read the Quran. You don't have to read it, skim over some of the verses. Mohammed preached genocide to make people convert. Simply not in my religion.
There were good people in Germany in 1939, but didn't stop Hitler from his atrocities. Though some would like to fortell it didn't happen. My Uncle was one that liberated Triblinka. He saw. Again, my question still stands, if Islam is such a good religion, why don't the Moderate Muslims speak out against the evils of the fanatics? Sometimes silence is the most thundering sound ever heard!
Ok every one else is allowed a view on this so i will get mine in as well note this scripture from the Koran as MANY muslims live by this text:-
O ye who believe do not take the Christians and Jews as your friends" 5:51.
"Slay the idolaters, those Christians and Jews amongst you,wherever you find them, take them and confine them lie in wait for them at every place of ambush. Fight those who believe not in Allah and the last day. Fight the unbelievers totally. Know that Allah is with those who fear him. Oh believers,fight the unbelievers who are near you and let them find you in a harshness; and know that Allah is with those who fear him and do his will"(Surah 9;42-47 the Koran.
Calling Islam evil is not a fact its your option. I couldn't give a rats arse what you guys say but I know many muslims and all are super people. And they didn't want to kill me because I wasn't one of them. Theres only one real evil regime at the moment and its not north korea, syria or iran. Its the worlds biggest polluter USA. Where to start, death penalty, Guantanamo bay, Hiroshima...
ben, you need to articulate your rhetoric in a more concise and erudite manner, you come across as ill educated, the way to construct an argument is not to deflect the argument to other parties IE the USA, but put forward your opinion constructively.
Zeeco, I'm not going to waste my time citing the koran or bible or any other religious text to build up some sort of academic thesis to prove to people Islam is not evil. I’m sorry, this isn’t the oxford debating club. People have been auguring over religions for 1000's of years, and it bores the hell out of me. What’s the point, you can't change someone else’s religious beliefs. Did Jesus really walk on water, come could Mary be a vigin and have a child, what came first the chicken or the egg. However you can respect their religion and try to understand them and not dismiss it as the next evil. That’s my point. I respect many things Nasfan has posted here, but this I don’t respect that point and I said so even if it was in an ill educated way.
Ben
yeah i am sure Osama bin laden is one of your "super" people and i am sure if you got to know him on a personal basis you would like him.
Your muslims friends should have thought about how George Bush would react before they flew the aircraft into the trade centre.
With regard to Hiroshima i think maybe if YOU or your family had been a prisoner of the Japs in asia during ww2 you would you would not come out with such ignorant comments about Hiroshima.
British American Australian and new zealand prisoners were being mutilated beheaded and their skin used as lamp shades for the Japs. Hiroshima was a blessing, i am only sorry the Americans did not bomb Tokyo.
Ben
yeah i am sure Osama bin laden is one of your "super" people and i am sure if you got to know him on a personal basis you would like him.
Your muslims friends should have thought about how George Bush would react before they flew the aircraft into the trade centre.
With regard to Hiroshima i think maybe if YOU or your family had been a prisoner of the Japs in asia during ww2 you would you would not come out with such ignorant comments about Hiroshima.
British American Australian and new zealand prisoners were being mutilated beheaded and their skin used as lamp shades for the Japs. Hiroshima was a blessing, i am only sorry the Americans did not bomb Tokyo.
Does anyone else also feel that east euro chicks have too high expectations out of themselves and life in general, which causes them to make themselves and those around them unhappy?
That's what I feel about Natalia, and I'm certain she's no scammer. Everything she's ever told me has turns out to be truthful. Now, she's settled for an rental apartment, legalization and wedding, which is less than 10% of getting a cheapest condo here.
Gemini some people don't speak out against George Bush and his evil? Okay cite the case. I've spoken out on many things against GW. Though one thing he is right on is Iraq and now the gathering storm in Iran. I haven't heard anyone show outrage against one leader calling for the total destruction of another country or race. Interesting fact, Israel, just hit Syria for a Nuclear Weapons station. What's interesting to me, and I'm sure many people in Europe have pondered this? Why is Korea there with nuclear supplies? It's one thing to have nukes, it's another thing to have the delivery vehicles. I just wonder, since Bush Lied about WMD's how many of Hussiens crossed over to Syria with the capability to deliver such payloads. People thought Churchill was a nut for constantly warning Europe about how they were mollycoddling Hitler. How many in Europe were willing to Negotiate away the Sudatenland and the Czech people all for the sake of peace with a madman. Which in the long run set up the ability for the Soviet Union to enslave the border states because of this sellout.
Gemini, I love the Bush haters and their absolute venom they spew. Bush Lied, Bush is Evil, Bush is stupid, Bush this and Bush that. That's all the Argument you have. What the hatred is, is for the American people who will stand up, rock the boat and take the fight to the people who deserve it. In our limited history, I've been reminded of that by another member here. We've been involved in two wars that were marginally instigated by us. Korea, Viet Nam. How many has Europe been involved in in it's history? It's a little silly to point fingers at the US. We were basically drug into WWI and WWII. There are times I wish we would take a more isolationist policy toward World events. Then when the rogue regimes start their genocides against innocent people who are going to come to their aid? Europe? Asia? The great United Nations? Please don't insult mine and your intelligence. Personally I think Bush is way off on Burma. Though it's as American as it can be to defend the defenseless. My hope is we stay out of it, but we'll get hammered for that. Just like we get hammered for doing nothing in Riwanda. Oh by the way we weren't the only ones who did nothing. People who refuse to acknowledge what history has taught are the ones who will relive the atrocities again.
Ben2006 you forgot Nagasaki. World greatest polluter. Now your true colors are starting to show. I thought for a while you were going to keep this at an intellectual level. I'm not being facetious in that statement. Pollution in what way, our live style, our culture or environmental. Attack us for the Death Penalty, what about the great Islamists you defend here? There are more death sentences issued in Islmaic countries for crimes far less than murder. That's hypocricy my friend. People die in Islamic countries for being homosexual. That's a nice and tolerant people.
You need to turn off CNN Europe and see the real America. I remember sitting in Zurich watching CNN Europe and laughing my ass off. Ted(Goebbels)Turner is the biggest purveyor of untruths it's ridiculous. Guantanamo bay, I like that also. Sept 11th 3000 innocent people died because of a mad and zealous idiot, Named Bin Laden, who in his own warped idea is the second comming of Mohammed. Sorry Due process works only for Americans in America. You have a world court, file the problem there. It's as impotent as the UN. What makes me suspect, is you have many of the liberal left talking points down to a "T". That's what CNN has done for Europe.
Now lets take the enviromental pollution issue. I don't know how much you've been to the US or whatever, but we strangle companies with regulations regarding pollution along with safe environements to work in. I don't hear this same outrage against China, who by far is the greatest polluter. Secondly I was in Paris 2 years ago, I thought LA had smog but Paris was Horrible,Ukriane for that matter is a toxic mess, thanks to the great anti pollution policy of the Soviet Union.
Ben2006, I appreciate the fact you have respected some of my posting here and I also respect the fact that our disagreement hasn't taken a personal nature. I don't believe in oppresive regimes or religions. People in the US don't worry about practicing their religions, though Christians in Islamic countries do have to worry, also in Communist Dictatorships. Instead of watching CNN, maybe flip over to EWTN. I catch that early in the morning while I'm reading on the internet. I appreicate the fact that you truly believe that Islam is a peaceful religion, but I will disagree with you politely. I think you have been subdued by it's own Rhetoric. Remember it is not wrong to lie as long as it promotes the life of Islam. That is in Mohammeds writings. This whole thing has nothing to do with religion, but about control and Totalitarianism.
Nasfan I've been to the states lots of times and I have said that the people are very friendly and the negative imagine of america is not a fair reflection of the people. The same is true for the middle east. Its same with FSU girls they aren't all scammers. Islam has many good aspects to it also, its not simply evil.
I don't watch CNN Europe (isn't it CNN International anyway?), but thanks for the advice.
I've never said that I truly believe that Islam is a peaceful religion, I just said its not evil. There are some things about Islam I don't agree with, but there are some good things.
Bush was dead wrong about Iraq. He lied about WMDs as a reason to commit war. That is by definition evil and makes him no better than Hitler. He then justifies this by saying he wants to spread democracy. The US does not want democracy in Iraq it wants a puppet state to allow it to plunder the oil resources.
You criticise Iranians for providing assistance to people who oppose you. The US are invaders and occupiers! 60% of Iraquis are Shiite muslims with a strong affinity to shiites in Iran. Iran has far more interest in a stable Iraq than the US its just the US is unwilling to accept Iranian influence the US wants to be boss and of course control the oil.
If the US spent the money they spend on the occupying force in Iraq on fuel conservation technology and fuel saving legislation you would reduce consumption dramatically, become self sufficient, reduce CO2 emmissions, and collapse the oil price removing the funding from all those groups trying to cause you harm. Oh but that would mean oil company execs would lose their super profits and their fat bonuses. Cant let that happen!
It is not acceptable for the US to have an attack first policy. You will rue come to rue it as the world already does. If you think attak first is an acceptable policy then you will have no problems if Russia takes out the proposed radar and anti missile bases the US is planning to build in Western Europe. You will just accept it because anyone who considers another country to be a threat is entitled to attack first without consequence. The US is only concerned about being a bully boy.
You are happy to have Guantanamo bay? A good example of how the US sees itself. Justice is only for Americans and anyone else be damned. It will be interesting in a future conflict when Americans are deemed unlwful combatants and subjected to summary judgement of unsavoury kind. Im sure you will express outrage then.
You are comfortable that the urrent administration accepts torture and is happy to turn people they kidnap in foreign countries over to regimes that torture these people? This is not evil?
I could go on about US arms sales to questionable regimes, support of dictators and regimes with human rights abuses, support of terrorist organisations in the past, protection of terrorists now but Im even boring myself.
The bottom line is the US does not respect international law and processes. It is time the Us became isolationist and let the world get on with its business without your help.
As I always say if the Americans hadnt kicked out the Brittish they would be civilised today!
gemini
this will put you right about britain and america their ties history and why these events are happening now:
http://www.gnmagazine.org/booklets/US/
The US dollar has depreciated so much that just in this week I've saved over a thousand dollars by transferring my money over here.
I'm back in Madrid. Me and Natalia are living together. Apartments are really expensive because there are many more people here than housing.
Natalia sleeps all the time, except when she goes to work. That's the way she was in Chisinau too. Whenever I called her in late morning or even early afternoon, she sounded like I had just woke her up.
Gemini, what you write is very sensible, the last 10 years have certainly seen the beginning of Americas demise, one reason is George Bush, how can the most powerful nation on earth have such an oaf as it's leader??? he is a joke and makes America look stupid.
there has also been the enlarging of the European union as well as the emergence of China and India, not to mention the Latin countries getting sick of the U.S.A. keeping them poor by not letting them import goods, which results in them having to grow coca leaves for cocaine, to make a living, only to see U.S. funded terrorists kill there crops!!!!
And don't forget, the U.S. is the only super power never have never won a war on it's own!!!
Vnigel, please don't insult our intellgence with all that bible crap about prophecies, at the time the bible was written, there was no Britain or U.S.A!!!!